[CAUT] huge pitch raise question

[Mitch Staples]

Michelle,

Tuners don't break strings, strings break when they're under stress.  Often
tuning is when the strings are most stressed -that's my story and I'm
sticking to it.

I don't break a lot of strings but if the piano has gone a long time without
tuning I tell the owner to expect a string or two to break.  Then when the
tuning's done and no strings have broken we all breath a sigh of relief and
hopefully they don't wait so long to have it tuned next time.  I would say
that each year about two or three strings break.

In 20 years I've only had one string break on the second pass so I don't
know what to say about that (maybe I broke 'em all on the first try).  If
it's happening a lot maybe you're rocking back and forth over the object
pitch a bit too much.

I usually don't move the pin to the left first, but if I feel some initial
friction I do.  I think that rocking the pin back and forth increases wear
on the pin block.  Also I think that my tunings are more stable if I move as
directly as possible from point A to point B.

I try to bring the whole piano to pitch in one pass without more that 10
cents or so over pull.  If the piano is new I'll go as much as 30 cents.  If
the piano is old, no over pull at all.  It's seems to me that older pianos
don't need so much.  95% of the time one pass will do it.  For improved
stability the quicker I can get through a pitch raise the better.  You can
get through many pitch raises without using mutes accept in the temperament
8ve.  It takes some practice but it saves about 10 minutes of what I
consider pure torture.  An ETD helps as it will usually ignore the incorrect
pitch in favor of the target pitch.  As long as the piano is generally at
pitch the fine tuning is as solid as ever.  I usually warn people that after
a big pitch raise the fine tuning won't be as stable as it will when the
piano is maintained properly.

I've noticed the increase tork you mentioned.  I figure it's a combination
of increased tension and the pin being screwed deeper into the block.


Mitch Staples

-----Original Message-----
From: caut-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org]On Behalf Of
Michelle Stranges
Sent: Monday, January 08, 2007 2:07 PM
To: College and University Technicians
Subject: [CAUT] huge pitch raise question


Hi folks-

Happy New Year!

:D

It happens more often than I'd like (and once is enough to be honest)
and while I "feel"  that it's not my lovely hammer technique ;)  ,
maybe it's something to do with some sort of "string thing"..

Has anyone else run across this?
(Or maybe a PTG article I have overlooked?)

Upon visiting a fairly new piano and finding it dreadfully flat (50
cents or more) , I carefully yet quickly, raise it up at least half
of what it was.
And I do have a (good?) habit of initially moving the pin in the flat
direction before moving it sharp in order to loosen any friction from
any rust or whatever that may have accumulated. Just a *quick* jerk
to the left- nothing serious at all.

Now.. having raised the piano up (with a second pass to at least get
it up to pitch) I start doing a "fine tuning".

it is either at this second pass or my fine tuning where strings
start to break.
In the usual places too- nothing out of the ordinary.

(Am I doing "too many tunings" (up to 3  times) to raise this
completely up? Seems like that wouldn't be an issue,  especially if
it's new(er)?
Have I introduced some sort of unusual friction/heat or something??


Now this doesn't happen all of the time, but I am acutely aware that
it could and I wonder if there's something in my technique or my
sequence of pitch raising that makes these newer strings break. (I
could understand some strings breaking if the piano was older..)

I know tuners who on the first go, bring the whole piano up tp pitch
but I've always been a little leary of that.
I'm wondering if they also have strings break on their second pass/
fine tuning..

I fully realize that they (the strings) are now at different spots on
all of the contact and termination points so I would assume that
would add to the puzzle.
And I'd like to also add that it seems that the tork alone on this
1/2 way-to-pitch, pitch raised piano feels MUCH higher than it did
before (and more than "normal") and I chalk that up to the higher
tension I have just introduced.

I am a jerk tuner.

(Stop laughing  :)

I would be VERY interested in viewing the number of passes you folks
do to bring a  piano up to pitch and whether or not you've
experienced this-especially on ones that aren't so old.

Hope this post reads OK- and I look forward to your responses!

:)
Michelle