I did read that. I think, however, that those constraints are not always apparent and in certain situations you might be setting yourself up for a misjudgment of your abilities. Often, the faculty in such an institution doesn't even understand the constraints. I don't think I'd want to go that route. I can think of several situations institutional and otherwise where I wouldn't want to rely on those judging my work to glean the constraints under which I was operating. Overall, if a certificate program were to be instituted, I think a judgment made on more neutral ground via completion of a class or program or testing, perhaps, would reduce the chances of that type of misjudgment. David Love davidlovepianos at comcast.net www.davidlovepianos.com -----Original Message----- From: caut-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Alan McCoy Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 3:52 PM To: College and University Technicians <caut at ptg.org> Subject: Re: [CAUT] CAUT credential vs. academic program? Yes David, I understand this. Hence my statement "...to see the context within which they work..." By context I mean, among other things, the constraints the technician is operating within. Alan > From: David Love <davidlovepianos at comcast.net> > Reply-To: "College and University Technicians <caut at ptg.org>" <caut at ptg.org> > Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 14:37:17 -0800 > To: 'College and University Technicians' <caut at ptg.org> > Subject: Re: [CAUT] CAUT credential vs. academic program? > > Unfortunately, many CAUT techs are caught between what they feel needs to be > done (ideal outcomes) and what the university is willing or able to pay for. > Those two things are often miles apart and assessing the tech in that > context may not be quite fair. > > David Love > davidlovepianos at comcast.net > www.davidlovepianos.com > > -----Original Message----- > From: caut-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Alan > McCoy > Sent: Monday, November 12, 2007 12:40 PM > To: College and University Technicians <caut at ptg.org> > Subject: Re: [CAUT] CAUT credential vs. academic program? > > I haven't been following this thread closely at all, except to see that it > has generated a lot of heat and comment. > > FWIW, I think the best, though certainly not the cheapest nor the most > practical, way to measure or evaluate a CAUT for a credential is an on-site > "inspection" like a NASM visit. What better way to evaluate someone than to > see, feel and hear their body of work? And to see the context within which > they work - the budget, the number and quality of instruments, the tools and > workspace, the details of the contract or employment they work under. > > Neither testing nor class attendance come close as evaluative tools. > > My 2c worth. > > Alan > > > > >> From: Fred S Sturm <fssturm at unm.edu> >> Reply-To: "College and University Technicians <caut at ptg.org>" > <caut at ptg.org> >> Date: Mon, 12 Nov 2007 12:51:27 -0700 >> To: "College and University Technicians <caut at ptg.org>" <caut at ptg.org> >> Subject: Re: [CAUT] CAUT credential vs. academic program? >> >> On Fri, 09 Nov 2007 06:22:03 -0600 >> Ron Nossaman <rnossaman at cox.net> wrote: >>> The notion that nothing can be >>> learned without someone teaching it to you is nonsense. >>> Ron N >> >> Absolutely correct. In fact, one can say that real >> learning only happens when the person learning takes >> responsibility. And much if not most of what we learn is >> done on our own without direction from anyone else (we >> might have been given initial direction, but then we work >> it out for ourselves, in our own way. In a music lesson, >> we are given direction, then expected to "practice, >> practice" - which is where we really learn it. If we learn >> it). The best "teachers" are those who inspire their >> learners to >> become self-motivated learners. The best learners are >> those who question what their "teachers" say, and try to >> come to their own understanding. >> Where does this thread have a practical application >> to the issue at hand, the potential creation of a caut >> credential? One way has to do with how piano technicians >> receive their training. A small proportion attend a >> formal, full-time training program like North Bennett. >> Most of us "pick up some here, some there," relying on >> formal or informal mentorships, factory-run intensive >> programs (usually week long), classes at regional or >> national institutes, reading the PTJ, books, listservs, >> etc. IOW, it is very difficult to measure what training >> most of us have had. Most of us probably consider >> ourselves "largely self-taught," however accurate or >> inaccurate that statement is on close examination. >> If this credential is to become a reality, we need to >> measure skill and knowledge in some way, rather than >> focusing on training. To get a handle on what we might >> want to measure, we can imagine an average piano >> technician with a background mostly in the area of home >> service, as in semi-regular tuning, a bit of regulation, >> necessary repairs for the most part. This, let us say, >> represents the level of skill and knowledge tested for in >> the RPT exams (and let's not get bogged down in examining >> those exams in detail. Too much of a distraction from the >> task at hand). Throw that person into a caut context. What >> additional chops and knowledge are needed? >> There are certainly some practical, mechanical >> skills and levels of skill that need to be addressed. >> Tuning well enough to get a check for a home tuning is >> different from tuning well enough for a professional >> musician and musical audience, and this is particularly >> noticeable in the concert situation. Especially in the >> clarity and stability of unisons. Regulating well enough >> to make the instrument work for most people is different >> from the precision and "subtlety" needed in the >> professional context. Not to mention voicing. There are a >> lot of procedures that are far more common in a caut >> context than in most others, like keybushing, tail >> scuffing, knuckle brushing, centerpinning to fine >> tolerances. >> And then there are organizational skills: "You have >> 500 hours per year to take care of 50 pianos. Go do it." >> Hmmm, how to get started? How to know if 10 hours per >> piano per year is enough? Where to begin? >> It would be lovely to have an actual educational >> program for cauts, full time for at least a few months. We >> are more likely to have to rely on classes at national >> institutes (moving out as possible to regionals), and >> factory programs like the one Steinway does at Oberlin, >> for the foreseeable future. I can certainly see the value >> in working towards regular caut intensive programs, where >> we bring cauts to various universities across the country >> from year to year to do a few days of hands on. It would >> take a lot of work to organize and prepare, and costs >> would certainly be an issue. I don't think it would be >> like Ed Foote's assessment of the financial rewards of >> having attended North Bennett: a clear financial plus for >> the attendee. >> In many ways, what we have before us is "an >> impossible task." Whatever we come up with will not be >> "ideal." Still, I firmly believe that we can come up with >> something meaningful and useful. >> Regards, >> Fred Sturm >> University of New Mexico > > > >
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