This is a multi-part message in MIME format. ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment ----- Original Message -----=20 From: Wimblees@AOL.COM=20 To: pianotech@ptg.org=20 Sent: September 11, 2001 5:54 AM Subject: new soundboard was Re: Killer Octave - Warranty Issue? In a message dated 9/10/01 7:44:05 PM Central Daylight Time,=20 RNossaman@KSCABLE.com writes:=20 I wonder which expensive piano that might be that gets sent back = through for=20 soundboard replacement when the problem is "discovered"? With such a = fine QC=20 and recursive correction system in place, I surely must be imagining = all=20 those=20 killer octaves, zero bearing, and negative crowned soundboards in = all those=20 expensive pianos as well as in the cheap ones.=20 Ron=20 Point well taken. But that opens up a whole new subject. Perhaps Del, = or one=20 of the factory reps, can chime in on this. At what point does a = manufacturer=20 say, "this isn't done right, lets do it again." There's got to be some = QC. If=20 the engineering is done right, and the jigs make the parts the same = way, how=20 come one piano has a great sound, and another, from the same line, = same=20 factory, same people, is dead? What is the criteria in the factory for = replacing the board?=20 -------------------------------------------------------------------------= ----- I rather doubt it's ever done. There is, from time to time, some attempt = made to fix a particular problem, but it would be in the form of heroic = voicing procedures, not something like replacing the soundboard. I once observed that a few ribs through the treble section of a = production grand piano were being feathered incorrectly--it was being = done backwards. This meant that the thinnest portion of the ribs passed = underneath the bridge through roughly the upper third of the scale. = After some period of denial--"That's how they're supposed to be." = "That's how we've always done them." "Nothing has changed."--it was = acknowledged that what I was standing there looking at was actually the = case and should probably be corrected sometime soon. Since this had = already been going on for several years it was not felt that any of the = carefully hand-crafted pianos already in process needed to be fixed = despite the general agreement that this little problem would probably = explain the rather disastrous performance through the = treble--particularly through the killer-octave region--of the piano in = question.=20 So, no. I would say it would be a pretty rare occurrence for a piano to = go back for something like a new soundboard just because there was no = crown, no downbearing or no performance.=20 In the case of limited downbearing I doubt that crown would even be = checked. Probably the plate would be reset or, more likely, the = nosebolts would be adjusted to bend the plate (Yes, Martha, bending the = plate. Even though, according to the official factory tour guide, this = is never done at the Bauble Creek Piano & Clock Manufacturing Co.!) down = until the bearing measurements are reasonably close to what they are = supposed to be.=20 Keep in mind that the workers building these pianos are not idiots. = Neither are they highly skilled technicians and/or rebuilders with a = broad background in, and understanding of, piano technology. They are, = instead, smart and highly skilled factory workers who know a great deal = about getting their assigned tasks completed quickly and efficiently. = When something comes down the line that doesn't quite work, there is = great pressure on those workers to make it work given the tools and = materials available. And, since they are smart and highly skilled, = whatever the problem is, it is made to work and the piano goes on down = the line. It would be nice to believe that any major mistake would be caught by = the supervisors but, of course, the supervisors get where they are = because they also are smart and have proven to be particularly skilled = at 'fixing' problems like this back while they were production workers. Quality control in either low- or high- production pianos is a sometime = thing and is not necessarily geared to ensuring the best of acoustical = performance. It is at its best when it comes to getting things to fit = and to getting the visual details and finishing done perfectly because = these are the things we technicians, along with the various piano = distributors, piano dealers and the piano buying public, all deem to be = most important.=20 In the case of something like soundboard function--a function poorly = understood by many manufacturers--it is unrealistic to believe problems = of the sort you folks have been discussing would even be fully = recognized, let alone identified with any kind of understanding of how = to deal with them. Unfortunately, it has been a long time since the = piano industry collectively has considered tone and action performance = to be a real and serious quality issue, else we would not have come to = the place of accepting the hard, linear sound of today's piano as = consistent with good production quality. Nor would we be accepting the = mediocre action performance found in many pianos throughout the price = spectrum. It has been my observation that 'quality control' in today's piano = factory is most often applied to the production process. When I began = studying the possibilities and processes of building low-cost, = high-production pianos it quickly became obvious that it would be vital = to carefully control 'quality'--as identified by component = tolerances--at every stage of the process simply as a cost control = measure. This represented a change from the traditional "American" piano = production process which depends rather much on the skilled, = hand-fitting of the various components that go into the piano. The = bellyrail is made in one shop to rather loose tolerances and sent over = to rim assembly where it is trimmed and fit to the rim. (An example, but = you get the idea.) Production tolerances applied to each component are = rather loose with the final fit being determined by the various skilled = workers along the line. To build low-cost, high-production pianos, it is = vital to have that belly rail cut to very precise tolerances so that no = hand fitting is ever required during assembly. Obviously, the latter = process will require much more expensive machinery and much tighter = controls all along the line.=20 Throughout the traditional piano making process the emphasis is on = making things fit and making things look good, and not at all on = ensuring that the acoustics work. Ron N makes the point, if I understand = him correctly, that the manufacturers are unconcerned about soundboard = functionality; a position with which I'm not sure I agree--although the = effect on the final product will be the same. I don't think it is a lack = of concern as much as it is a lack of understanding. And, since = people--regardless of their salaries and positions--fear what they do = not understand and tend to avoid what they fear, there is a tendency to = simply avoid the whole issue. For the same reasons they also tend to = avoid making changes to their established designs and processes that = might lead to solutions to the problems they have convinced themselves = don't exist. It is also important to understand that some of the companies you folks = are now most critical of have, over the years, tried various changes--at = the time considered to be improvements--to the pianos we know and love. = Obviously these changes did show initial promise or they'd not have been = introduced, but some of them later proved to be disasters. One of the = difficulties our industry constantly faces is that it sometimes takes = years for the unintended side effects of a change to work themselves out = and for any potential problems to become evident. And we are not an = industry that forgives or forgets easily when things do go wrong. = Problems the auto industry simply shrugs off, the piano industry--mostly = via us technicians--remembers for decades.=20 If, and only if, the piano market once again begins to regard the piano = as a vital component in the ongoing work of art known as music and then = demands that the piano once again, consistently and competently, exhibit = the qualities necessary to produce that music, can all of this change. = Personally, I think the marketplace is right now sending the industry a = message via their pocketbooks. The marketplace is keeping is = increasingly keeping that pocketbook closed. I think it is demanding = more musical and more appropriate pianos for today's society. Unless it = finds them it will go elsewhere and buy other things. It remains to be = seen whether or not the industry gets the message. =20 It is entirely possible to build both limited- and high- production that = consistently deliver both good action and tone performance. (Actually, = it is easier to design and manufacture good tone performance than it is = to deliver consistently good action performance--fewer parts involved.) = But, our emphasis will have to change. Beautiful cosmetic detailing and = perfectly flat polyester finishes do not a good piano make. But that is = what we have been demanding and worshiping for the past thirty years and = that is what we have gotten. Perhaps now it is time to go back to work = and bring back--and build on--the musicality of the past. Well, again I ramble, so will close.... Del Delwin D Fandrich Piano Designer & Builder Hoquiam, Washington USA E.mail: pianobuilders@olynet.com Web Site: www.pianobuilders.com =20 ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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