Pitch Raise Questions

[SUSAN P SWEARINGEN]

Sorry - I meant without the Verituner!!  Some people seem to like the SAT
III better for pitch raising but I've gotten very used to the coarse tuning
display on teh Verituner.
----- Original Message -----
From: "Greg Torres" <Tunapiana440@cox.net>
To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: Pitch Raise Questions


> Perhaps she meant 'without' the Verituner?
>
> Best,
> Greg Torres
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Farrell" <mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com>
> To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 7:33 PM
> Subject: Re: Pitch Raise Questions
>
>
> > "Of course, I'd be much slower with that marvelous machine called the
> Verituner!"
> >
> > Please expand on this and tell us why. Thanks.
> >
> > Terry Farrell
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "SUSAN P SWEARINGEN" <ssclabr8@flash.net>
> > To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 6:23 PM
> > Subject: Re: Pitch Raise Questions
> >
> >
> > > I always pitch raise from A0 and tune the unisons as I go.  I use a
> rubber
> > > mute when I go from the single low bass strings to the bi-chords and
> have
> > > all the tri-chords strip muted.  When I get to the tri-chords I use a
> > > pattern that speeds up things considerably.  I will tune the center
> string
> > > of, say, A4 (with my ETD).  I'll then pull out the left side of the
> strip
> > > mute and tune the left string of A4 to the center string of A4
> (aurally).  I
> > > will then move up to A#4 and tune the center string (with my ETD).  I
> then
> > > pull out the left side of mute as before and then tune the left string
> of
> > > A#4 to the center string of A#4 (aurally).  At this point, I drop back
> down
> > > to A4 and aurally tune the right string of A4 to open center and left
> > > strings of A4. I then move up to B4 and repeat the procedure.  You
would
> be
> > > surprised how fast this goes.  I'm a new tuner myself (Randy Potter
> > > graduate) and doing pitch raises in this manner takes me about 20-25
> > > minutes.  It allows me to schedule a 2-hour tuning appointment - pitch
> > > raise, fine-tune, and make any minor repairs and adjustments.  Of
> course,
> > > I'd be much slower with that marvelous machine called the Verituner!
> > >
> > > I use 20% overpull in the bass, 35% overpull for the first 6
plain-wire
> > > strings in the tenor, and 25% overpull for the rest of the piano.
Why?
> > > Because Dr. Sanderson has shown that using these overpull amounts
along
> with
> > > tuning unisons as you go, gets you very very close.  When using this
> method,
> > > I have found that strings tend to fall 1 to 2 cents away from
perefect -
> and
> > > this is with pitch raises up to 100 cents.
> > >
> > > Corte Swearingen
> > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > From: "Farrell" <mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com>
> > > To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> > > Sent: Tuesday, June 25, 2002 8:31 AM
> > > Subject: Re: Pitch Raise Questions
> > >
> > >
> > > > Have you enjoyed your varying responses? Anything over 25 cents is a
> pitch
> > > raise (PR)? Anything over 4 cents is a PR? Use 25% offset? Use the SAT
> PR
> > > feature, but adjust offsets?
> > > >
> > > > I am also a Randy Potter grad. What all the above means is that you
> need
> > > to experiment and find out what works for you in various situations.
All
> the
> > > responses are correct - for the person responding. I would give you a
> whole
> > > additional set of responses!
> > > >
> > > > My suggestion is to start by following Randy Potter instructions and
> SAT
> > > instructions. See how these guidelines work, and then modify them as
you
> see
> > > fit, so that you get the results you want.
> > > >
> > > > I don't think you will find any definitive guidelines for when a
pitch
> > > raise is needed. It always comes down to a benefit/cost thing. If you
do
> not
> > > use any pitch correction on a piano that is below standard pitch, and
> you
> > > use standard pitch as your target, you will ALWAYS end up with your
> tuning
> > > below standard pitch. Even if the piano is an average of ONE cent
below
> > > A440, if you use no pitch adjustment and a one pass tuning, the each
> note on
> > > the piano will end up approximately 1/4 of a cent below A440. Now,
that
> > > would be acceptable in most any situation.
> > > >
> > > > But what many do with a SAT, is use the SAT PR feature to calculate
a
> > > target pitch. Read your SAT manual. Instruction are pretty clear. Most
> techs
> > > would agree that using the SAT III PR feature on a piano that is
between
> 2
> > > and 5 cents flat will yield an acceptable tuning in one pass.
> Personally, I
> > > lean toward the 2-cent limit - some go to 10 or 20 cents in one pass.
> I'm
> > > simply not comfortable with that. But in any case, if you are doing a
> > > one-pass tuning on a piano that is one/two cents or more flat - use
the
> SAT
> > > PR feature.
> > > >
> > > > The SAT manual says to tune unisons as you tune each center string.
> > > >
> > > > Doing two passes is strictly up to you and the results you want. Two
> > > passes will always get you a better tuning. On really junky pianos
where
> > > there is no hope for a fine tuning anyway, I will go up to 10 cents in
> one
> > > pass. On any better piano, I will go two passes for anything more that
> about
> > > 2 cents flat. It just comes out better for me that way.
> > > >
> > > > Regarding measuring how flat the piano is. The more notes you
measure,
> the
> > > better idea you will have of average pitch deviation. I measure at
least
> all
> > > the As, if not all the As and Ds, and sometime even more notes to get
a
> real
> > > good idea of what I am dealing with and what my approach is going to
be.
> > > >
> > > > Hope this helps. Good luck with the course. Check back in.
> > > >
> > > > Terry Farrell
> > > >
> > > > ----- Original Message -----
> > > > From: <euphoniac@juno.com>
> > > > To: <pianotech@ptg.org>
> > > > Sent: Monday, June 24, 2002 11:19 PM
> > > > Subject: Pitch Raise Questions
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > I am currently a Randy Potter student with some questions about
> pitch
> > > > > raising.  When I measure the pitch of A4 with my SAT III, how low
> (in
> > > > > cents) should it be for me to need to perform a pitch raise?
Also,
> when
> > > > > performing a pitch raise, is it better to raise only the single
> strings
> > > > > all the way up, or should I raise all of the strings of each note
as
> I
> > > > > go?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Don Palmire
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
>