SW heresy?

Sarah Fox sarah@graphic-fusion.com
Sun, 22 Aug 2004 12:13:25 -0400


This is a multi-part message in MIME format.

---------------------- multipart/related attachment

------=_NextPart_001_002D_01C48841.6CC09A30
Hi Ric, everyone,

Thanks for all the feedback.  I look forward to hearing even more!

You wrote:

> Stanwoods particular curve shape is=20
> somewhat a subjective choice me thinks... tho he may say different.  =
He=20
> can and from time to time does provide custom curves for given=20
> situations that are not quite this same shape. Steinways own default=20
> curve is somewhat flatter btw.

Ah hah!  Yes, the hammers I have are duplicates for a Steinway D, so =
that would make a bit of sense.  The curve isn't just "flatter," but =
really quite flat.  It's flat as though by intent.  I find that =
interesting.  A picture is worth a thousand words.  (This GIF, at 9 kB, =
is pretty economical.)



The jump between 21 and 20 is of course the bass/tenor break, with the =
bass hammers having more molding to them.  The "SW target" curve, in =
fucsia, isn't *necessarily* my target, depending on what comes from this =
discussion.  It's merely the best fit, per a linear regression analysis.

Now that I look at this curve a bit more -- and look a bit more at the =
hammers themselves -- it would appear that there is a natural curve in =
the set, that is stepped apart across 20/21 because of molding =
differences.  However, the treble end (where the piano is gonna be the =
most finicky) is straight as an arrow.

My original intent was to even out the larger jags in the curve and then =
to see how the hammers perform in the piano, before doing any more major =
adjusting.  This is in part because my keyframe is vacationing in =
Florida at the moment, and so this was something I could do in the mean =
time!  <grin>  I'm now thinking it would be a good idea to wait until I =
can install these hammers in the piano and assess their initial =
performance before doing *anything* to them.  Well, it might prove =
informative to experiment with the low tenor by wrapping copper wire =
around the tips of the shanks to bring those hammers up to the linear =
curve.  The beauty of a spreadsheet is that it can tell me what length =
of copper wire to cut and wrap around each shank.  :-)

Incidentally, I've thought about how to do the final adjustments.  I've =
of course generated an errors column that tells me how much needs to be =
added or subtracted from the SW.    Provided I'm adding or subtracting =
weight from the molding itself, this value is identical to the change in =
weight of the entire hammer assembly.  Therefore, this process can most =
easily be performed by weighing the hammer (and shank and flange -- =
higher than the SW, of course), and adjusting the *total* weight by the =
same amount.  This wouldn't involve the more laborious process of =
positioning the hammer "just so," with the shank level and the flange on =
a stationary support, sticking up exactly 90 deg.  Instead, I can simply =
put the entire hammer on the tray.  Easy.  This process is made easier =
if I simply tare the balance to the old weight, but I still need to =
record the original weight, just in case time runs out, and my balance =
shuts down.  ;-)

> > So is this something that is the way it is just because of tradition =

> > -- because the cauls are built that way, and that's what ya' get?
>=20
> It seems reasonable to assume that the chosen manufactured shape of a=20
> set of hammers would directly affect the basic shape of the curve. =20
> Cutting of hammer sets into individual hammers no doubt accounts for=20
> some of the spikes... as does variations in wood density... and =
probably=20
> a lot of other things I havent really thought about.

I guess I'm thinking more of the linear proportions in the dimensions of =
the heads.  If I'm not mistaken, you could take a slab of uncut hammers =
and sight a straight line along all surfaces.  Correct?  (Ray??)  =
Interestingly, the entire keyframe is laid out in straight lines as =
well, with longer dimensions in the bass and shorter in the treble.  Ray =
explains that the felt in the bass hammers is less dense than in the =
treble, so that would explain the basic form of the SW curve.  With =
linear dimensions all around, and with progressively decreasing felt =
density, combined with increasing proportions of felt with the =
larger/lower hammers, there would actually be a fall-off in the bass end =
SW.

I would think that if hammers were to be matched in mass to the strings =
they're hitting, the hammers in the high tenor and low treble would be =
much lighter.  But then again, consider the entire range of the piano.  =
It's HUGE.  There's a LOT of difference between the mass of the A0 and =
C8 strings, and this difference is so large that matching hammer mass =
would be an entirely impractical venture.  We'd be hitting C8 with =
paperclips and A0 with bowling balls (exaggerating, of course).  This of =
course leads me back to the question of whether the shape of the curve =
really means anything.  In consideration of the range of the piano, a =
concave downwards, Stanwood-type curve isn't really much better or =
worse-matched to reality than a linear relationship.  So perhaps the =
best approach is to simply even out what comes out of the box and work =
from there.  Hmmmm?

I indeed wanted between a Stanwood #8 and #9, and that's pretty much =
what I got, throughout the bulk of the piano's range.  I'm not going to =
get too worked up if I'm in the #10 range in the high treble.  After =
all, those notes are pretty easy to play anyway!  ;-)  I think it's all =
going to come down to tone.  Whatever needs doing, that will dictate the =
shape of the curve (e.g. if some felt removal is ultimately needed here =
or there, *BUT ONLY WITH THE APPROVAL AND GUIDANCE OF MY MASTER-SAN*).  =
My job will be to make it smooth.  Taking Isaac's advice about touch and =
tone being psychoacoustically/perceptually linked (which I highly =
suspect is the case), I imagine I'll be doing a bit of back-and-forth =
between touch and tone, until I reach the optimum via the process of =
successive approximation.  However, I'm going to keep this work to a =
minimum until AFTER I rescale/restring!=20

Meanwhile, I would still love to know if there's any magic to the shape =
of these Stanwood curves (David??) or whether they largely reflect the =
natural curves of hammer sets, resulting from the way they are =
manufactured (as I suspect).

Thanks for the input, y'all!  Interesting stuff, to be sure!  :-)

Peace,
Sarah

------=_NextPart_001_002D_01C48841.6CC09A30
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/attachments/58/46/6e/10/attachment.htm

------=_NextPart_001_002D_01C48841.6CC09A30--

---------------------- multipart/related attachment
A non-text attachment was scrubbed...
Name: not available
Type: image/gif
Size: 11299 bytes
Desc: not available
Url : https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/attachments/58/2c/f0/3f/attachment.gif

---------------------- multipart/related attachment--



This PTG archive page provided courtesy of Moy Piano Service, LLC