---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment Hi Matthew, The technician I studied with used a very old upright (with water=20 damage from a basement flood!) to teach on. Though the beats were=20 fairly easy to hear. If you know any other technicians you may want to=20= get their opinion on your piano. It might be fruitful to ask around at=20= churches if they have any pianos that aren't used which you could use=20 for tuning. I thought it was generally believed that learning on a good piano is=20 better. After I was done studying with the technician most of my tuning=20= was on a Baldwin SD-10 - I'd say doing much early-tuning on such a big=20= piano gave me a different perspective, particularly in the bass. -- John > Thanks for the replies.=A0 I am practicing my tuning on a 1913 Hinze=20= > upright.=A0 Is that doing me more harm than good here?=A0 I think it = is=20 > hard to hear lots of stuff on that piano, but then again, I am a=20 > beginner, so I don't know if it's more the piano or more me not having=20= > trained ears yet.=A0 I know lots of families with much newer pianos,=20= > should I try to hook up with one of them and maybe work it out with=20 > them to practice my tuning on it? > =A0 > Matthew > > BobDavis88@aol.com wrote: > Matthew writes: > When I tune the temperament octave (A3-A4), it needs to be a 4:2=20 > octave, correct?=A0 > No. Read the many replies which said that it should usually be wider=20= > than that. > And one way to test this octave is to play the A two octaves above the=20= > lower note as the test key, to hear the partials in the octave, am I=20= > right? > Not exactly, but read Don Rose's comments on ghosting. > =A0 If the octave you are testing has no beat whatsoever, you have a=20= > perfect temperament octave, is this true? > No. There is no such thing as a beatless octave. An octave which is=20 > not beating at one level, such as 4:2, will be beating at all other=20 > coincident partials, such as 2:1, 6:3, 8:4. The higher the beatless=20 > coincident is in the chain, the wider the octave. A good compromise=20 > octave is usually pretty quiet, though, > =A0 > Matthew, > =A0 > If you have kept this trail of posts on octave tuning, please go back=20= > and re-read it, and the links to which you were referred, including=20 > the ones to the AccuTuner manual Appendices F and H. People are happy=20= > to spend time helping you, but you've got to do your homework and read=20= > the replies. At the risk of repetition, I include, directly below, a=20= > copy of my post from last week on this subject: > Bob Davis > ------------- > Matthew's original question was how to tune a 4:2 octave. Several=20 > people, myself included, sent the tests, aural and visual. Whether=20 > that [meaning 4:2] is appropriate for the temperament octave on a=20 > particular piano is a second question. Tuning so that "the 10th is=20 > just noticeably faster than the third" might produce a good width of=20= > octave, but it is NOT a 4:2. [It's wider] > =A0 > A clean 4:2 octave IS wide at 2:1, and narrow at 6:3. Most aural=20 > tuners naturally gravitate towards a temperament octave that is very=20= > slightly wide of 4:2 ("the 10th is just noticeably faster than the=20 > third"), which will be substantially wide of 2:1 and a tiny narrow of=20= > 6:3. This gives an octave that is pretty clean-sounding, and produces=20= > fifths which are pretty clean and fourths that aren't too trashy. Any=20= > octave size can be divided into 12 equal half steps. A true 4:2=20 > octave=A0will produce cleaner fourths and more movement in the fifths,=20= > and on most pianos will be unnecessarily narow. However, on some=20 > pianos with high inharmonicity,=A0a wide temperament octave added to=20= > a=A0clean octave below, will produce a double octave that is too = noisy.=20 > It's a balancing act. > > Do you Yahoo!? > vote.yahoo.com - Register online to vote today!= ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: text/enriched Size: 3865 bytes Desc: not available Url : https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/attachments/79/76/92/29/attachment.bin ---------------------- multipart/alternative attachment--
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