Always good to start out with a 12 ft. tree, they get to 12 ft quicker....;-] David I. ----- Original message ---------------------------------------- From: Michael Gamble <michael@gambles.fsnet.co.uk> To: Alan Barnard <tune4u@earthlink.net>, <pianotech@ptg.org> Received: Mon, 20 Jun 2005 21:01:33 +0100 Subject: Re: Piano Religion ... was Pitchlock >Hello List and Alan B - who was so bold as to state that there are more ways >of killing a cat (I think that's right!) >something to do with cream... At least, that was the gist of it. Good for >you Alan. We all have our little foibles, our little religions and we are >all sure we all do it the right way. By "it" I mean tuning and action work. >There was me the other day lambasting all and sundry about excessive use of >computer tuning devices instead of using the ears we were given and trusting >in them. I fully subscribe to that obviously. Others go the way of thumping >bridge pins or wrest pins or doping hammers or doping wrest pins or >extracting bridge pins and re-inserting them in a goo or glue...and needling >deep and shallow on the striking point or under it.... At the end of the day >if the piano turns out not only as you feel it ought to but to the clients' >satisfaction, then everyone is happy... No-one should thump the drum and say >"you're wrong!" There's a little bit of right in all we do otherwise we >wouldn't all still be in business. Anyone heard from Isaac Oleg lately? And >this is where the List comes in. On it we broadcast our questions and we >try and answer these in the way we honestly feel (I hope!) and the Tuning >World is a better place for it. There's a lot of answers out there to many >problems - each of us has an answer to many of them and those answers may >indeed be in conflict. We presume that all those giving those answers are >giving them in the spirit (here we go - religion again!) of passing on >experience having "been there and done that and this is the way I did it" >Good show! Here's a strange thing.... If you play M10 chromatically in a >bass-wards direction on a well tuned piano and the bottom note goes into the >bass covered section, like as not the beat-rate will suddenly change in one >piano. Do the same in another with the same criteria and the beat-rate may >not change - that is it may continue to gradually slow down in accordance >with the frequencies involved and the twelfth root of 2. The better the >piano the more linear the change, the covered section making no difference >to that expected change. Ever noticed that cats have holes in their fur just >where their eyes are? >I planted two Silver Birch trees in my garden today and already they're >twelve feet tall... My way of keeping green... >Regards from a balmy Summer evening in the Downland Village. Michael G.(UK) >----- Original Message ----- >From: "Alan Barnard" <tune4u@earthlink.net> >To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org> >Sent: Monday, June 20, 2005 4:26 AM >Subject: Piano Religion ... was Pitchlock >> Just returned from KC and was interested in the comments below. I was in >> classes and conversations with some of our most experienced >> rebuilders/voicers/concert prep types, etc., and wish to comment on an >> observation. I mean this to be light--and certainly not offensive--but not >> quite tongue-in-cheek, either, because there is a serious side to it ... >> >> One person taught: ABSOLUTELY, always seat the strings on the bridge >> (light >> taps, rubbing, pushing with material softer than string steel, etc.). >> Another said: ABSOLUTELY, always give all the bridge pins a judicious tap >> or two before you even think about tuning or voicing. Ron says: No way to >> either procedure, and I think others agree with him. >> >> One said: NEVER EVER "cross stitch" voice under the strike point. Another >> said: BY ALL MEANS, needle this felt. Some said: Use steam, use pliers, >> use >> alcohol/water. Others: NO NO NO NEVER. One said he only uses lacquer, >> another said he never uses lacquer (takes too long to dry and much too >> long >> to stabilize), always use plastic/acetone. Most people say: NEVER deep >> needle the strike point and rarely sugar it. One said, basically, Have at >> it! and proceeded to demonstrate it on a new hammer in a new Kawai >> grand--deeply, aggressively and vigorously, too! >> >> I spent 3 hours with Virgil Smith, a treat. Very interesting and a >> delightful person. Some think he's something of a mystic in his approaches >> to tuning, and don't subscribe to them. >> >> Anyway, I used to think our business was about 1/2 art and 1/2 science; >> but >> no more. I am now convinced it's about 1/3 art, 1/3 science, and 1/3 >> religion! >> >> By the latter, I mean that people practice what they BELIEVE to be true >> art >> and what they believe to be true science; what they have faith in because >> of their own experience and their faith in the people they learned it >> from. >> Others--of different piano religions--believe other things, often >> radically >> contrary. >> >> And there is NOT -- as our Internet discussion about "where the flatness >> goes" proved -- a sufficient body of scientific study, or even collected >> empirical data, to prove or disprove anybody's piano religion. >> >> Nor is there anything approaching artistic consensus on many, many topics >> that are really quite important. So we have little that can be described >> as >> uncontested orthodoxy in piano belief--with the possible exception that >> soaking a piano in a pond is generally agreed to be a bad idea unless the >> words "Winter & Sons" appear on the fallboard. >> >> I find this fascinating. People trying to learn the craft over many years, >> have surely been frustrated that the path to enlightenment has so many >> forks in it! >> >> The saddest thing is that sometimes, as among all religions, hard feelings >> are often harrowed up and much bitterness has arisen, over the years, >> between people who should be friends and collegeaues. >> >> BTW, Scott would disagree with some of the Pitch-Lock comments that have >> been posted lately. For one thing, they would tell you to fix the >> string/bridge problems, etc., and only use the clips to fix bad string >> matching, mysterious falseness, and other nasties that won't go away after >> all else is tried. >> >> Alan Barnard >> Salem, Missouri >> >> P.S.B.S. If nominated, I will not run for Piano Pope; if elected, I will >> not serve. I would, however, wear the cool hats. >> >> >>> [Original Message] >>> From: Ron Nossaman <rnossaman@cox.net> >>> To: Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org> >>> Date: 06/18/2005 10:17:50 PM >>> Subject: Re: Pitchlock >>> >>> >>> > Has anyone had experience with the pitchlock devices. It sounds like >>> > something that would help with some wild bass strings, and maybe even >>> > some false beating treble strings. However the startup cost is pretty >>> > hefty. Not bad if it does what it says, but I thought I might inquire >>> > from the list first. >>> > Any thoughts?? >>> > >>> > Ed Carwithen >>> > John Day, OR >>> >>> >>> No experience, but coupling a flagpoling bridge pin to another pin >>> by a pitchlock staple pretty much has to limit the flagpoling that >>> causes the false beat. Short of actually fixing it, this is likely a >>> quick, non destructive alternative. WAY better than seating either >>> strings or pins. >>> >>> My call >>> >>> Ron N >>> _______________________________________________ >>> pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives >> >> >> >_______________________________________________ >pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
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