Protecting plain wire from rust

[Geoff Sykes]

That's kinda what I thought. I didn't expect this to be a miracle cure for
already rusted strings. I was thinking like more of a band-aid to try and
hold them where they are. Some of them are already starting to break. High
treble area, and always at the capo bar. If I can talk her into restringing
I would certainly give the "oil" cloth treatment a test.

Thanks for the reply.

-- Geoff Sykes
-- Assoc. Los Angeles


-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of Tom Servinsky
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 3:43 PM
To: Pianotech List
Subject: Re: Protecting plain wire from rust


Good question. Wouldn't hurt. But rust that has already gotten in areas 
where it is impossible to clean is going to continue to do damage. As far as
a process, I would simply do a light wipe down of the strings with 
the "oil" cloth , trying not to touch the wound strings.
I will say that in additional to this method, I am a strong advocate of the 
string cover felt concept. The good quality string cover felt will add 
needed protection and ( at least) slow the progression of rust. Tom
Servinsky

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Geoff Sykes" <thetuner at ivories52.com>
To: "'Pianotech List'" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 5:35 PM
Subject: RE: Protecting plain wire from rust


> Tom --
>
> I have a customer with a 1919 Hazelton Bros. piano that I service
> regularly
> that has rusty strings. The piano has had a DC in it for years. I recently
> replaced it as the tank for the old one literally fell out of the piano.
> Nevertheless, and in spite of the fact that the DC is functionally 
> correctly
> and is properly maintained, the strings continue to show increasing signs 
> of
> rust. Do you think that employing your Vaseline treatment to these strings
> at this late stage might be beneficial? If yes, how would you go about
> applying this treatment to strings already in the piano?
>
> -- Geoff Sykes
> -- Assoc. Los Angeles
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On
> Behalf
> Of Tom Servinsky
> Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 1:54 PM
> To: schecter at pacbell.net; Pianotech List
> Subject: Re: Protecting plain wire from rust
>
>
> Mark,
> I think that I made myself very clear. Use a very min. amt of Vaseline 
> and work it into a cotton cloth. Simply wipe the string enough to coat 
> the strings. That's it. I also made it very clear there is absolutely 
> no goo or gummy appearance to
> the string. In fact there is no sign at all that the string is coated. I 
> can
>
> say that after 25 yrs of doing this on piano in the tropics, the 
> strings stay looking pristine. Keep in mind that we also use humidity 
> control within the piano as well. As
> far as the Protek is concerned, this could be a very good R & D project
> for someone, maybe like yourself, to begin a study and report back to us
> your findings after 1, 5, 10, 20 yrs. Then we can figure if Protek could 
> be
> a good additive.
> My studies for my method, as of now, are complete and valid over a 25 yr.
> period with absolute success. Not that there are not other ways to skin 
> the
> cat, but this particular method does work with great success. To date, I
> have never had to go back and re-coat. Tom Servinsky
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mark Schecter" <schecter at pacbell.net>
> To: "Pianotech" <pianotech at ptg.org>
> Sent: Sunday, March 26, 2006 2:43 PM
> Subject: Re: Protecting plain wire from rust
>
>
>> Hi, Tom.
>>
>> Thanks for writing. The vaseline idea is interesting. I have two 
>> concerns about it. The more minor one is, are the strings at all 
>> gummy, and do they attract or collect dust? Not that it would be very 
>> much, but let's say, ten years down the line, are they still shiny? 
>> Do you ever renew the coating, and if so, what do you do about the 
>> area around/between the tuning pins?
>>
>> The other concern is, since vaseline is a petroleum product that we 
>> know melts with even very slight heat, could there ever be 
>> contamination of the pin block? I suppose you're using so little, you 
>> wouldn't expect it, but it seems worth asking anyway.
>>
>> Also, I wonder whether any manufacturers do anything to treat plain 
>> wire, especially when the piano is destined for a humid environment? 
>> With so many pianos being made in Asia, I would think that rust would 
>> be a concern right from the beginning. What about the wire and pins 
>> they store for manufacturing?
>>
>> As far as using Protek being more expensive, I wonder just how much 
>> it would really cost per piano? When I have used it prior to tuning, 
>> I've been using the liquid on a piece of felt as a spreader. But I 
>> guess you could just as easily make your oil cloth with (what is it?) 
>> MPL.
>>
>> That brings to mind the question of active ingredients. With 
>> vaseline, it's the grease that's doing the protecting. With Protek 
>> liquid, it's Teflon (presumably). With Protek MPL, I suppose it would 
>> be both. What I like about the Protek liquid is, there is no grease 
>> involved, even if it's more expensive.
>>
>> So anyway, thanks for your thoughts!
>>
>> -Mark
>>
>> Tom Servinsky wrote:
>>> Mark,
>>> Make yourself a small  oil cloth by working a small amt. of Vaseline 
>>> in a small piece of fabric ( T-shirt material). Simply wipe the 
>>> string with the oil cloth just prior to installation and the string 
>>> will remain looking new even through bad tropical  conditions.
>>> We live in the tropics where hurricanes have wrecked havoc in our area
>>> over the past 2 years. Where most pianos strings rusted out due to the
>>> excessive salt exposure, the pianos we have rebuilt using this methods
>>> came out squeaky clean.
>>> There doesn't seem to be an adverse affect on tonal and string behavior
>>> using this method.
>>> I idea of using Protek has crossed my mind however the cost vs the
>>> Vaseline doesn't make good economic sense.
>>> Tom Servinsky
>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mark Schecter" 
>>> <schecter at pacbell.net>
>>> To: "Pianotech" <pianotech at ptg.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 25, 2006 12:15 AM
>>> Subject: Protecting plain wire from rust
>>>
>>>
>>>> Hi, all. Here's something I've been wondering about.
>>>>
>>>> In pianos with rusty strings, I use Protek on the strings where 
>>>> they pass under the capo, and where they pass through the agraffes, 
>>>> as well as on the counterbearing felt, to help ease rendering. It 
>>>> works, and seems to keep on working for at least a few months, 
>>>> maybe longer. I have
>
>>>> often wondered if there is any substance (such as, oh, maybe, 
>>>> Protek?) that people use on clean, shiny strings to prevent rust or 
>>>> tarnish ever developing? I could imagine taking whole rolls of wire 
>>>> and dipping it in
>
>>>> a bath of XYZ-stuff before stringing, or sponging it on in the 
>>>> piano.
>>>>
>>>> We are instructed to coat practically every other metal surface in 
>>>> every device in our lives (think car) with something or other, so 
>>>> why not piano strings? I guess we could expand the question to 
>>>> include copper-wound bass strings, too, if anyone has any thoughts 
>>>> about those. I'm interested to hear people's ideas.
>>>>
>>>> -Mark Schecter
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>
>