[pianotech] Broken Grand dampers

[Paul McCloud]

Hi, Bob:
    Very confusing.  Any chance for pictures?  My first thought it, does the damper tray return to it's original position?  Check to see if the pitman dowel and pin are situated in the tray and the underlever.  If the tray isn't returning to it's low position, that would explain why the dampers won't return all the way down.
    "the damper barely missed the left string at full una corda. "   I assume you meant "the hammer".
    Is there a player mechanism installed?
    Simply moving some hammer flanges a fraction isn't going to change how the dampers work.  If you put a shim behind the rest block at the left side of the action cavity, I could see perhaps a problem with the key ends missing some of the underlevers.  I assume you didn't do that.  
    You say you pulled the action and nothing seemed out of place, loose, broken, etc.  Did you inadvertently leave any small tools in the action/cavity that might have gotten stuck in there?
    I'd say to remove the action again and check things out.  I would assume that no other changes were made to any damper wires, nothing was removed/replaced in the back action, no screws were removed from the damper rail, no dampers were removed/replaced, etc.  
    If you haven't moved anything, nothing is broken, everything is exactly as it was before you moved the hammer flanges, then I'd say we have a mystery on our hands.  There HAS to be something more to this.  Get a strong light and look more carefully.  Be sure the sostenuto blade has been adjusted properly (you didn't move it, right?).  
    Other than that, I'd ask a colleague to take a look at it.  Nothing like a second pair of eyes to see what one might have missed.
    Good luck.
    Paul McCloud
    San Diego


----- Original Message ----- 
From: Bob Tate 
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Sent: 01/22/2009 7:36:45 AM 
Subject: [pianotech] Broken Grand dampers


Hi people,

I've had to be away because of a bad back--still hurts like crazy.
_______________

I believe a major problem may have just happened with my Estonia 190.  

I've been working on getting the una corda pedal to be just as I want it, or rather make certain the hammers hit the strings in just the right place when it's depressed.   (i.e., not how depressed I feel right now)

Here's what happened: 

this morning, I made a minor change to a hammer flange position. I put the action back in the piano. 

When I pressed the una corda and let it return, the alignment looked as I wanted it, the damper barely missed the left string at full una corda.  The shift works properly.

Next, I pushed down the damper pedal. 

All the dampers lifted as expected, however, when the pedal was released, the entire set of dampers hung, just above their "at rest" position.

I checked the action to make certain it was properly seated on the key bed  and in the piano as far back as it could go. It is.

I tried the damper pedal again.

This time, on the damper return, I heard a "creeeek" or rather, "creekcraaack." And the dampers still hung slightly above their at rest position.

Not liking that "crack" sound; with the damper pedal not depressed,  I lifted and let drop, each damper head,  manually.

All worked as expected, except E2 (the last damper before the end of the bass bridge and before the bass/treble strut).
Lifting it, I felt a little, loose up/down and side to side, wobble.
Letting it drop, maked an audible "click," then, "thud" as it returned to where it started. 
The thud sounded like wood on wood.

I pulled the action. Looked at and wiggled the damper flanges and wires, checked for loose screws, and saw/felt nothing wrong.

With the action still out, I checked the sostenuto, which as had the dampers, been working perfectly.

The sostenuto is a complete mess: dampers lift haphazardly or not at all.  (The tabs all look in-line.)

Not having much grand damper repair experience, I returned the action and have stopped.

I've called for reinforcements. I'm afraid this may be a major problem: a broken damper rail flange or even rail itself, broken damper return spring?

Any ideas of what I might be able to check, without taking apart the damper mechanism (and probably making matters worse)?  
--I know of nothing more I can do or will do, lest you have a suggestion. 

what we know is:  
the dampers hang barely above the strings when "at rest," 
the manual lifting of E2 (last damper before the bass strut) makes an audible "click" and then, wood-on-wood "thud" when allowed to drop to its rest position, 
the sostenuto is a total mess,
the shift works okay.

I won't touch it, unless it's something easy to check; but, I'd like to have ideas as to what it might be.

Thanks,
Bob T

______________________________________________________________________
A painter paints his pictures on canvas. But musicians paint their pictures on silence.
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