No, but don't disregard one over the other, until you've actually solved the problem. Let's just leave this where it's at. Wim -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Todd <toddpianoworks at att.net> To: pianotech at ptg.org Sent: Sat, Jun 13, 2009 5:09 pm Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) Hi Wim! ? You said "don't 'argue' with us".? I actually was mainly arguing with you.? But, when five people give five different remedies to a problem, are you suggesting not to argue not even with one of them?? TODD PIANO WORKS Matthew Todd, Piano Technician (979) 248-9578 http://www.toddpianoworks.com --- On Sat, 6/13/09, wimblees at aol.com <wimblees at aol.com> wrote: From: wimblees at aol.com <wimblees at aol.com> Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) To: pianotech at ptg.org Date: Saturday, June 13, 2009, 11:31 PM Matthew Somewhere along the line I got the impression it was a spinet. In which case, removing the action would?have been a hassle, and adding a jiffy weight to the key would have been the easiest and least expense cure to the problem. But since it's a console, before adding drilling holes in the keys and adding weight, or even just putting a jiffy lead at the end of the key,?I would highly recommend that you take a few minutes to remove the action and repin the wippen flanges. Don't just add a lubricant. That sometimes will give you a false reading. You might even want to consider reaming out the bushing cloth, or if you don't have a reamer, put on a new flange. As several people have said, adding weight to the back of the key will make the key work better, but it won't solve the real problem. I commend you for asking questions. That's what this list is for. But when we?give you advice, don't "argue" with us. Trust us with the advice we give you. Good luck, my friend, and?keep asking questions. That's how all of us learn. Wim -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Todd <toddpianoworks at att.net> To: pianotech at ptg.org Sent: Sat, Jun 13, 2009 11:30 am Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) It is a console.? And the issue starts at the treble break and continues to C88.? Not every single one is slow in the treble, but about 20 are. TODD PIANO WORKS Matthew Todd, Piano Technician (979) 248-9578 http://www.toddpianoworks.com --- On Sat, 6/13/09, wimblees at aol.com <wimblees at aol.com> wrote: From: wimblees at aol.com <wimblees at aol.com> Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) To: pianotech at ptg.org Date: Saturday, June 13, 2009, 9:26 PM Matthew I'm confused here. Is the piano we're talking about a spinet, with a drop action, or a console, with a direct blow action? Also, I think you mentioned that this problem is throughout out the upper treble section. Is that right, or is it just one or two keys??? Wim -----Original Message----- From: Matthew Todd <toddpianoworks at att.net> To: pianotech at ptg.org Sent: Sat, Jun 13, 2009 10:41 am Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) Do most Wurlitzer consoles have weights in their keys to begin with?? The reason I ask is because the piano in question does not. TODD PIANO WORKS Matthew Todd, Piano Technician (979) 248-9578 http://www.toddpianoworks.com --- On Sat, 6/13/09, Gerald Groot <tunerboy3 at comcast.net> wrote: From: Gerald Groot <tunerboy3 at comcast.net> Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) To: pianotech at ptg.org Date: Saturday, June 13, 2009, 8:39 PM If we free it up and it works, that means then the key weights in the fronts do not need attention or addtions to the rear of the key. If a person wants to go through and re-pin that's fine too.? But, like I and others have said, I've been able to clear up all of the problems without re-weighting. Eliminating the problem, not the symptom is the resolution. -----Original Message----- From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Ron Nossaman Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2009 4:24 PM To: pianotech at ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] sluggish (was no subject) Gerald Groot wrote: > *The last time I actually placed any weights on any piano was over 30 > years ago.? It may take time to figure it out.? Sometimes, we all need > to call in the troupes for assistance to figure out what is causing > these problems but, just because weighting 'appears' to solve the > problem, that does not mean, that is the problem.? * And I think it's just the opposite. Just because lubricating the wip centers made it work doesn't mean that was the problem. The keys are too front heavy. If everything else is optimal and as friction free as possible, the action will more or less work anyway. It doesn't take much friction in a key bushing, wippen cushion or center, or whatever, to make these actions sluggish. Friction levels in these places in other better balanced actions aren't usually show stoppers, but these actions are right on the edge of functionality at best. I have, through the years, put leads on a few keys in Wurlitzers, when lubrication and easing didn't get it, and the customer wasn't interested in spending what it was likely to take to otherwise make it "work", but just wanted that one or two keys to be made to work as economically (cheaply) as possible. Ron N ? _____? avast! Antivirus <http://www.avast.com> : Outbound message clean. Virus Database (VPS): 090613-0, 06/13/2009 Tested on: 6/13/2009 4:39:58 PM avast! - copyright (c) 1988-2009 ALWIL Software. Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill. Make your summer sizzle with fast and easy recipes for the grill. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... 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