[pianotech] Brass Inlay Repair on S & S Former Concert Grand

[Tom Driscoll]

I believe it's an image of a lyre on the "audience" side of the piano. I never realized that the finish was built up around the brass.
Tom D.
  ----- Original Message ----- 
  From: Greg Newell 
  To: pianotech at ptg.org 
  Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 7:41 AM
  Subject: Re: [pianotech] Brass Inlay Repair on S & S Former Concert Grand


  Agreed! This list is a great source for info. Speaking of which . just what decal are we talking about here? I've never seen one on the lyre. What did I miss?

   

  Greg Newell

  Greg's Piano Forté

  www.gregspianoforte.com

  216-226-3791 (office)

  216-470-8634 (mobile)

   

  From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of PAULREVENKOJONES at aol.com
  Sent: Thursday, May 21, 2009 1:58 AM
  To: pianotech at ptg.org
  Subject: Re: [pianotech] Brass Inlay Repair on S & S Former Concert Grand

   

  I just have to say that this is the epitome of what communication on this list is about. My kudos to Bill Monroe for taking the time and effort to make a very clear picture of the process and its pitfalls. 

   

  Thanks, Bill.

   

  Paul

   

  In a message dated 5/20/2009 11:01:43 P.M. Central Daylight Time, bill at a440piano.net writes:

    Hi Thomas,

    I've done just this repair.  As others have suggested, it's a little troubling.  In the end, my experience was, well......OK.  Two new brass "decals" later (yes, then entire onlay must be purchased each time, logo and lettering), the results were fine from the audience.  There are a number of problems with this mess.

    First:  If the brass lifting is very minor, you can try the tiniest amount of thin CA.  Using a jewelers oiler is probably the best option.  The finest supply house hypo really delivers more than you need and the needle forces you to lift the brass more than is desirable.  Sometimes this can work.  When it fails go to......

    Second:  You can try removing the old lyre onlay very carefully (maybe heating as Jon suggested) and then fitting the new only in the old lacquer shadow.  I tried this, gave up.  The details of the brass onlay are so fine it is nearly impossible to get it to just "drop in" to the old lacquer shadow.  And, if it doesn't just "drop-in" you'll have to pull it back off to reposition - which means you'll bend the brass out in the process.  If by some minor miracle this works for you, proceed to "Fourth."  And, for those of us living in reality, when that doesn't work either........

    Third:  What worked for me was removing the entire piece (use whatever indexing method you like for replacing it).  I wouldn't worry about chipping the edges of the lacquer, for your next step will be to............wet sand the lyre area starting at 220 to take down the buildup of clear that was around the original lyre onlay.  I sanded an extended area, basically from the lettering up to the top of the treble side, staying away from the edges which are usually either already burned through from the factory, or soon to be by you.  Basically, you are trying to make it so the area around the new onlay won't "pop" as a repair.  Once the buildup that was around the original onlay was worked down "a bit," I sanded up to p400.  Then apply the new lyre onlay.

    Fourth:  Once you have the new onlay installed, give the treble side a couple or three "mist coats" of lacquer (you can get it in a rattle can, either from S&S or from Walter Wurdack company.  Then I did a clear doty type of touch up around the lyre to fill in any major unevenness in the finish.  A medium coat of clear, come back tomorrow and sand level, fill in any remaining holes/divots doty style, another medium coat.  Come back tomorrow, heavy coat, next day, level and heavy coat..............ad infinitum, ad nauseum.  You must also take care to feather in the new lacquer with the old finish, I usually aim to taper the spray off at the middle of the outside treble case curve, and the entire treble case side ends up getting sprayed before it's done.

    This is a challenging repair.  Best in the shop.  It shouldn't be done in someones home - too much spraying, too much wet sanding, too much chance of having the finish mucked up with daily traffic, too many trips to make the repair (DAMHIK).  You are spraying lacquer - the entire piano needs to be covered - I taped the cover cloth to the top of the treble side rim and then up and over the piano to prevent any lacquer from getting into the belly area.  

    When you are wet sanding to prep the area for the new onlay, DO NOT use any lubricant other than water.  It can cause you all manner of trouble getting the new onlay to adhere.  Again, DAMHIK.

    For the final sand, it's to p400 for me, with water/wool lube and then to 0000 wool with water/wool lube, then polish.

    It really is quite a time consuming repair.  

    William R. Monroe




    On Wed, May 20, 2009 at 3:02 PM, Jon Page <jonpage at comcast.net> wrote:

    The thin brass is not an inlay, it's an onlay or applique. As Paul stated,
    the finish is built up around it. Even if you can purchase the solitary "S"
    without having to but the whole applique, you will also be extremely
    lucky to remove the old letter without chipping the margins.

    Maybe applying heat with an iron (surface protected with a cloth)
    to the "S" will soften the glue and margins enough to limit damage.

    The whole area will then need to be sanded through the clear
    protective coat to make the color and patina make on the brass
    and a clear coat put over it all.

    If they want it all looking the same, remove all the other letters
    and leave the black silhouette.
    -- 

    Regards,

    Jon Page

     

   


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