[pianotech] Lyre Damage

[William Truitt]

It's been about 20 years so, I am fuzzy on some of the details, but I think
it was.

Will

-----Original Message-----
From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf
Of David Ilvedson
Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 3:22 PM
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage

I wouldn't think that was a permanent distortion... 

David Ilvedson, RPT
Pacifica, CA  94044

----- Original message ----------------------------------------
From: "William Truitt" <surfdog at metrocast.net>
To: pianotech at ptg.org
Received: 11/26/2009 10:24:43 AM
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage


>Rebedded it.

> 

>Will

> 

>From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On
Behalf
>Of Lou Novak
>Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 12:15 PM
>To: pianotech at ptg.org
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage

> 

>Will-

> 

>You wrote;

>    I tuned it often, and cared for its needs for regulation and voicing.
>As such I had a pretty good
>idea of the levelness of the keybed before the move, and afterwards.  Where
>the bed had been flat and the frame bedded before the move, it was not flat
>and the frame floating at the ends afterwards.

> 

>Wondering, did you find the condition corrected itself or did you re-bed
the
>key frame?

> 

>-Lou 

>----- Original Message ----- 

>From: William Truitt <mailto:surfdog at metrocast.net>  

>To: pianotech at ptg.org 

>Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 9:01 AM

>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage

> 

>Hi Ron:

>I think it would be fair to say, that unless you see the perps committing
>the atrocities to the keybed, the evidence is going to be indirect and
>anecdotal.  That said, I do remember one German Steinway C that was housed
>in a large facility and concertized on regularly.  I tuned it often, and
>cared for its needs for regulation and voicing.  As such I had a pretty
good
>idea of the levelness of the keybed before the move, and afterwards.  Where
>the bed had been flat and the frame bedded before the move, it was not flat
>and the frame floating at the ends afterwards.  I did not see the move, but
>did know that the movers had set the piano on the lyre as part of the move
>(I asked them later).  My guess is that they had set it down roughly, and
>that had caused the distortion.  If you take the lyre out the equation as
>part of your teardown process, it is not possible to set it down roughly
and
>damage the keybed.  

>My mover, who does about 1,000 to 1,500 pianos a year, often does the
>following:  He removes the lyre, and sits in a chair in front of the keybed
>as close as possible to the bass end.  His helper lifts the bass end and
>sets it down on the chaired movers knees after he has slid them under the
>keybed.  His knees are open 6 to 12 inches during this process.  The piano
>is then sitting high enough that the helper can with some leisure remove
the
>bass leg, after which point they position they skid board underneath to
then
>lower the piano onto it from there.  Set up reverses this process.  I have
>seen him do this with concert grands too.  These are full time professional
>movers who work very quickly and safely, and I have learned a lot from
>peeking over their shoulder.  They work smart, not hard.  You could say
>there are old piano movers and there are dumb piano movers, but that there
>are no old, dumb piano movers.

>To what other possible causal agents would you possibly attribute the
upward
>distortion of the keybed that we so often see?  I am sure there must be
>others, but I remain of the belief that setting the piano on the lyre can
be
>one of them.  

>Will









>-----Original Message-----
>From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On
Behalf
>Of Ron Nossaman
>Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 11:08 AM
>To: pianotech at ptg.org
>Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage

>Porritt, David wrote:
>>> I've said many times that the 
>>> lyre is meant for hanging and the keybed cannot or should not take the 
>>> weight of supporting the piano even temporarily
>> 
>> You mean, like sitting on the piano horse - on the key bed?
>> Ron N
>> 
>> But the piano horse distributes that same weight across the whole key bed
>rather than a few square inches above the lyre.

>Quite so. I'm curious though. Have any of you found action 
>problems you could attribute directly to setting a piano up on 
>the lyre? Any actual evidence of key bed damage from this? I 
>never have, but there are still an infinity of places I 
>haven't been. So I was wondering if this is real, or yet 
>another of those "intuitive" things. I know broken lyres and 
>crushed corners on bottom plates are real, I'm just wondering 
>where all this concern for the key bed comes from.
>Ron N