Horace
Nice contribution to this thread!
My funny take on state of music and how we've let slip down to such a
mediocre level goes like this:
Using Adam and Eve as a starting point, there were no establish language,
rules, musical instruments,clothes, bathing suits, etc.
Lets call that 12 o'clock, using a clock as our time frame.
Eventually as society took hold,language was developed, civilizations firmly
established,clothes not only became important but law, even the bathing
suit took on a look. Eventually the bathing suit got longer and longer .
Let's call that 6 o'clock.
Then the bathing suit starting getting smaller
Lets fast forward to 11:50pm.
The bathing got even smaller
11:59 we're down to skinning little thong.
The difference between 11:59 and 12:01 is mute at best.
Using that same idea, use the development of music.
12 o'clock cave men were probably banging on sticks and stones, and even
without a developed form of language, I'm sure there were beginnings of
some type musical expression
12:15 musical development has been firmly establish.
Western diatonic scales are fully developed.
Musical instruments are becoming fully developed.
12:30 Lets call this the era when everything got big. Romantic symphonies
could go on for 50 mins, operas- 4 hrs, orchestras grew larger and larger.
And most important how we started as a society to applaud good musical
expression. An appreciation to good tone were at it's height. And it was
then when most of keyboard temperaments were taking hold.
12:45, as we get into to the 1900's, the musical style starting to get
shorter and shorter ( think bathing suit)
Jazz musicians learned that you could get away with a mistake because the
note was only a note away from being correct. And it became part of the jazz
style.
Keyboard temperaments have been reduced down to the equal temperament.
Fast forward to 11:59
We now have Rap music, which clearly has taken any artistic concern for
tuning, tone, or clarity. We've taken the form structure away from the song.
We taken way even back chordal progressions which define musical movement.
What we're left with is a few steps away from 12:01 with cavemen beating on
sticks and stones and grunting.
Like it or not, that sound has permeated the listening culture. It has
taught our modern society you don't have to go through formal training. Nor
do you have to practice your craft. It's like when the monkeys were
literally throwing paint on a canvas it and then sold as art.
I can't help but wonder how this influence and lack of appreciation to the
fine art of music affects our own industry.
Until that time clock again goes through the progression of having a
resurgences into an appreciation and awareness for fine musical art, I'm
afraid were in this rut for some time to come.
And you wonder why the tone of the pianos have diminished through the
years.....
Tom Servinsky
----- Original Message -----
From: "Horace Greeley" <hgreeley at sonic.net>
To: <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Friday, December 02, 2011 1:03 AM
Subject: Re: [pianotech] Knowing good sound (was Upright Price)
>
> Hi, David,
>
> Interesting that the thread is moving in this direction.
>
> The whole concept of how our understanding and appreciation of piano sound
> has changed over the years was the topic of one of the classes I taught at
> the WESTPAC conference in March.11. Having promised notes from those
> classes to a number of people, I have been trying to finish revising and
> updating them to post to this list before it's final demise...which
> appears to be fast upon us.
>
> The subject is vast, having multiple layers that bridge generations of
> recording and "playback" technology, musicology, approaches to
> performance, and, importantly, human beings. And, as with so many other
> subjects, any three or four people are going to have at least ten or
> twenty different perceptions. It's very fascinating...certainly no one
> "right" answer, to be sure.
>
> To be more on point to your last question: I think that we're very much
> the poorer for the gradual homogenization of piano tone that has taken
> place over the last several decades. On the other hand, to paraphrase
> your observations, the world has changed a great deal, too.
>
> As I was reminded just today: In terms of things (especially "Classical"
> things) struggling, I think it's important to remember that, writing in
> the mid-1950's, Arthur Loesser ("Men, Women, and Pianos: A Social
> History") noted that the piano is "cold-weather" entertainment. That is,
> it was something to do when one really couldn't spend a good deal of time
> outside. The relevance is that, over the last century, a number of other
> "cold-weather" entertainments have become important in various cultures.
> While some of these are more ancient than others, more latter-day
> "entertainments" have been progressively more technologically
> enhanced...which is to say that, while the tune has remained largely the
> same, the variations have become potentially more complicated over time.
>
> Thinking specifically of music, within just a couple of generations, we've
> moved from the hearing of music in performance as a real-time, live shared
> experience to where the hearing of music is something many people do
> solely within the privacy of their cranial cavity. With a nod to Anna
> Russell, these cavities often appear to be places in which some folks have
> resonance where their brains ought to be. One bit of fallout from that
> condition is that the "actual" sound of pianos in performance or recording
> is, in effect, no longer relevant. Whatever the original instrument
> may/may not have sounded like, we can often only faintly imagine (the
> potential of vacuous space existing between our ears notwithstanding).
>
> This isn't really a new topic. I remember reading an essay by Nicholas
> Slonimsky some years ago that was published in an anthology of essays
> (which was published in 1957) about music (especially piano) performance.
> In that article, he specifically noted the negative influence of the
> recording industry on music...writing that "it used to be" that artists
> would learn a more limited repertoire "to perfection", performing pieces
> with which they were really comfortable and over which they had good
> command; but that, with the advent of recordings, it seemed that "everyone
> had to record everything"...especially all the works of a given performer;
> and that, in the process the unique qualities which the artist brought to
> specific works became "lost in the forest of having to learn everything".
> I had borrowed the anthology, and have looked for it for years so that I
> can get that story more accurately. Perhaps someone on the list
> recognizes it and would let me know.
>
> Being more realistic about the future, though, it's important to note that
> piano sales are effectively flat and have been for several years. Many
> people who track these kinds of things think that piano sales track with
> those of larger furniture items. I'm not sure that's accurate. At this
> point, I think that pianos sales track more accurately with the sales of
> other kinds of media and related devices. The sales of DVDs and CDs, for
> example, have plummeted in the last few years. Importantly, this drop in
> sales has not been countered by an growth in streaming media...the Netflix
> nonsense notwithstanding. Where is the money going? Just as importantly,
> where is the time going that might otherwise have been spent doing things
> like practicing the piano, watching movies, or listening to CDs? I
> suspect that, at least in the SF Bay Area, at least part of that time is
> going into online gaming (by people of all ages and persuasions). While
> not at all conclusive, I asked about that during some consulting I was
> doing with several (smaller) ISPs in various geographic areas. Each of
> them reported that they had been increasing their overall capacity (to
> provide faster and higher capacity Internet access) more quickly than they
> had planned; and that the rates at which they have had to expand those
> services cannot be accounted for by people simply doing streaming audio or
> video (Netflix, etc). Rather, their internal statistics support the idea
> that, other than clearly business-related traffic, Internet-based gaming
> is what it is driving the demand. Although I suspect that this is going
> to vary widely by geographic location, I also suspect that what is
> happening in more populated areas will be followed elsewhere.
>
> Back to the piano, though, highly recommended reading is: Craig Roell,
> "The Piano in America: 1890 - 1940", which is readily available from
> places like: www.abebooks.com . In concert with the Loesser book
> mentioned above, Roell's treatment of the subject (which ends just before
> WWII) lays a foundation which makes understanding how things have evolved
> since 1940 much more accessible. At the end of the day, we are (perhaps
> at best) curators in a museum...a museum which has decreasing funding,
> shorter hours, and fewer visitors every year. In many ways, we are the
> sole support of that museum, and our ability to keep it open (even for our
> own amusement) is predicated on our willingness to adapt our skill-sets to
> provide support for the piano sound du Jour as it changes and is changed
> by contemporary performance and recording practice. It really should not
> be much of a surprise that this is exactly what those who have come before
> us have had to do, as well.
>
> More later on this...hopefully before the electrons stop flowing from this
> address.
>
> Kind regards.
>
> Horace
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> At 10:12 AM 11/30/2011, you wrote:
>>I've given this a new title as it may be going off-topic a bit from
>>Upright Price.
>>
>>Xeno, these are interesting thoguhts you express. I've talked about this
>>q bit recently with people of my generation and bit younger. HiFi used to
>>be a Big Thing. When we were young, we saved up and bought our first
>>"proper" HiFi, and took care to position the speakers nicely, and to sit
>>at the apex of the sound so as to get the proper stereo effect. The cost
>>of an LP vinyl record was relatively high in relation to a week's wages,
>>so they were things to treasure. Turntables were (and still are, in a
>>niche market) esoteric things, to be properly balanced and set up.
>>
>>Over the last few years, I often observed two students sharing one each of
>>a pair of earphones, to listen to a song. They often have docking
>>stations at home, of course. But just as often they are content to listen
>>through tinny PC speakers. The concept of HiFi as a "thing" to be
>>enjoyed, has greatly receded.
>>
>>Where does all this leave recorded piano sound? I don't know. The idea
>>of promoting listening to live music is good. But, esopecially for
>>"serious" music, it's a small market. And the recorded music industry,
>>especially for "Classical" is struggling.
>>
>>On the other hand, of course, it is much easier than ever before to MAKE
>>a high-quality recording (in terms of recording quality anyway).
>>
>>What do others think, about appreciation of piano sound?
>>
>>Best regards,
>>
>>David
>>www.davidboyce.co.uk
>>
>> >Most people don't know what a good piano sounds like. More and more
>> >people out there have never heard a good piano, live, in person. Put
>> >that together with the rise of Craigs List, and that aged piano sound
>> >is becoming the new standard. There's also the change over all in
>> >hi-fi sound: people don't go for big speakers anymore, they listen to
>> >music on their tinny little computer speakers, or their phone device.
>> >The MP3 format also reflects this mass acceptance of lower quality
>> >sound.
>
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