[pianotech] plate finishing

John Formsma formsma at gmail.com
Tue May 8 20:31:02 MDT 2012


See attached.

:-)

On Tue, May 8, 2012 at 9:19 PM, Dale Erwin <erwinspiano at aol.com> wrote:

> Hi Will
>   Wow...you must a been a fly on our wall  this week. Thanks for the
> detailed information. We may try this asap.
>  As one who has struggled at times with the plate spray procedure this
> sounds quite predictable and with finishes, that's really what I am looking
> for is a predictable outcome.
>   The problem I've had with Poly urethane clear coats is that they attract
> dust like a magnet. So even with a spotless environment, inevitably there
> is a the dust. So how was that defeated in you process?
> We ahve used acrylic lacquer for 14 years & most the time I like it. The
> clear is easy to mange by a clean room and wetting the floor. Spray and get
> out. No fan till it flashes off ten minutes later.
>   Our process is very similar to yours and its generally easy to touch up
> and fairly idiot proof. But on occasion Murphy comes a round and then I'm
> unhappy.
>
> Murphys my Uncle
> Dale
>
>
> *Dale Erwin... RPT
> ** Mason & Hamlin/Steinway/U.S pianos
> www.Erwinspiano.com
> 209-577-8397
> *
>
>
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Encore Pianos <encorepianos at metrocast.net>
> To: pianotech <pianotech at ptg.org>
> Sent: Tue, May 8, 2012 6:44 pm
> Subject: [pianotech] plate finishing
>
>   Recently I revisited my plate finishing process for my rebuilds and
> have made some changes to my process.  I am using automotive paints and
> primers.  While these materials are more expensive than throwing some plate
> gold into a can of Nitro lacquer, they will give a better finish and are
> more durable.
>
> Automotive paints are more evolved than the lacquers that we use in our
> case finishing.  But it’s a big industry and can be confusing when trying
> to find your way to good products that will best meet your particular
> needs.  It is invaluable to be able to deal with an experienced  paint pro
> at the automotive finishing department at your local auto parts store.  I
> spent a lot of time talking with a fellow named Joe Red Cloud, whose been
> doing this stuff for 25 years, and he has done (and still does) auto
> painting on the side.  His wife runs the video store in my town and I have
> known him for years.  He is a film buff like me, so I was lucky to have a
> very friendly helping hand to guide me.
>
> It is important to have a clear sense of what you want the paints to do
> for you.
>
> I started using auto paints 10 years or so ago when I was having some
> adhesion problems that persisted through a couple of plates (I was using
> nitro lacquers and metallic gold powders).  So I wanted to go to a system
> that could give me consistent results.  So I was advised primer, base coat,
> clear coat.  At that time, I was able to find a particular color of gold
> auto paint that matched the old Steinway color pretty much dead on the
> money.  I used to love to bring a customer into the shop and show them the
> plate, telling them that I was able to find these extra special materials.
> They’d look at it and say, “It’s so beautiful”.  I’d say, “ask me what it
> is”.  “What is it?”, and I would reply with a smile, “Dodge Dart Gold”.
>
> They no longer make it, and it is pretty hard to find gold paints,
> particularly ones that you like.  Instead of a pre-mix gold, I will add a
> gold metallic powder to my base coat.  I have been able to find a couple of
> good sources for various shades of Gold.  Larry Buck turned me onto a
> company called Crescent Bronze, which has many colors of gold.  They are
> at, http://www.crescentbronze.com/order_products/chromatone.
> Unfortunately, the color charts online are all but worthless, so you would
> need to order some color charts from them.  Not so for at
> https://www.nnigroup.com/glandmp/default.aspx .  They have about 75
> shades of gold, and large circular patterns that clearly show the color.
> Prices vary depending on the color, but generally about $20 for 6 oz., $41
> for 16 oz.  Those amounts will do a lot of plates.
>
> I start with the primer.  Primer is important for a couple of reasons.  It
> will adhere to the sanded surface of the original paint and bond  well with
> the top coats.  Also, primer will sand more easily than the top coats and
> can go a long way to having a level and smooth surface for the succeeding
> coats to adhere to.   I will have washed the plate and wet sanded it with
> 220 wet and dry paper.  Putty the dings and wacks with bondo or another
> filling putty and sand level and even.
>
> I discovered a new primer that I really, really like because it sands so
> easily, but gives you a very smooth surface when you are done.  It is SEM
> High Build Primer Surfacer, and is available in 5 colors.  It only comes in
> 20 oz. aerosols, (about $17) which was surprising to me – it is not
> available in quarts or gallons.  That is not necessarily a bad thing.  The
> aerosols spray well and lay finish quickly.  If you sand through your
> primer and need to touch up a few spots, you don’t have to clean the gun.
> 1 to 1 /2 cans is enough to do the average plate, spraying on 3 coats at 10
> minute intervals.
>
> I was amazed at how easily and quickly it sanded, powdered right up and
> did not clog the paper.  In fact, I found it better to use Scotch Brite
> Scuff Pads, starting with Maroon and going to Grey.  They worked as quickly
> as the sandpaper, but had the added advantage of conforming to the
> irregular curves of the plate readily.  Less sand through.   I spent about
> 2 hours scuffing the plate smooth as a baby’s bottom after priming.
> It’s the best primer I have used.  It’s really important to spend your
> sanding time here to get a good surface to lay the paint on.  The sanding
> will never be any quicker or easier than at this point, and you are laying
> the foundation for top coats that will lay down smoothly.  Joe told me that
> the collision guys love this stuff because it works so easily and is
> fantastic for spot repairs.  Highly recommended.
>
> It used to be my practice to mix the gold powders with the top coat clear
> and spray it on, then follow with the clear.
>
> There is a better way to do it than that.  Joe turned me onto what is
> called an Intercoat Carrier.  That is a clear that is specially formulated
> to mix with metallic powders or pearls.  It will hold the particles in
> suspension  better than a straight clear, and flows out and levels better.
> I sprayed a couple of test panels, one with regular clear, one with the
> intercoat clear.  Night and day difference – the intercoat carrier
> definitely lays down much better.  The one that I use , Deltron DBC-870
> Intercoat Carrier is $108 per quart.  But you mix it 1:1 with reducer, so
> that’s really 2 quarts, and you will use about 2/3 quart for a  plate.
> Three wet coats at 15 minute intervals.   Let sit for ½ hour and you can
> then clearcoat.  Otherwise you will need to scuff before you clearcoat.
> The intercoat carriers do require a top clearcoat.
>
> For the clearcoat, I use Dupont ChromaClear HC-7776S Clearcoat, with
>  Dupont ChromaBase 4 to 17765S activator reducer.  Since I do not like the
> high gloss glitter of the clears, the Chromaclear is mixed with One Choice
> SU4985 universal matting agent.  This allows me to control the sheen, which
> I prefer as a semigloss.  This will give depth to your finish and
> accentuate the curves of the plate with a bit of glow, and draw out the
> colors more.    2 to 3 coats at 5 minute intervals.  I do not sand or
> polish the top coat.
>
> For plate lettering, I used the  Shachihata  Artline 400XF paint marker,
> which I got from a local art supply store.  It’s a felt tip, and the
> pigment in the paint covered well, comes in 2 sizes.
>
> I don’t  pretend to be an expert here.  Rather, I am sharing the expertise
> of others and reporting the positive results that I have had, so that
> others may benefit if they are so inclined.  I would love it if others
> share what they have learned along the way that has brought them good
> results.
>
>
> Will Truitt
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>



-- 
John Formsma, RPT
Blue Mountain, MS
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