<HTML><BODY style="word-wrap: break-word; -khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space; ">Hi Jeff,<DIV><SPAN class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </SPAN>The hooks I use are just the cheapest, thinnest right angle hooks I can find. About an inch long on the threaded side, with the short angle maybe 1/4 - 3/8". Cup hooks would be fine, but they cost more. After screwing them in (I use a small vise grip), I give each about a 30-45 degree bend upwards in the middle of the long side with a damper wire bending tool (the kind you put in a handle), for better and more reliable grab of the grommets. </DIV><DIV><SPAN class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </SPAN>My duct tape "grommets" hold up fine, but its harder to find the hole for re-installing. With the grommet, it's very easy to feel the grommet and hook and get it attached. I had tried grommets earlier, using a punch and anvil method (a set also sold with the grommets, used with a hammer, and cheaper than the pliers), but found it took too much time and results "varied." The pliers type work real well. One squeeze and you're done, and the results are reliable.<BR><DIV> <SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><SPAN class="Apple-style-span" style="border-collapse: separate; border-spacing: 0px 0px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); font-family: Helvetica; font-size: 12px; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; letter-spacing: normal; line-height: normal; text-align: auto; -khtml-text-decorations-in-effect: none; text-indent: 0px; -apple-text-size-adjust: auto; text-transform: none; orphans: 2; white-space: normal; widows: 2; word-spacing: 0px; "><DIV>Regards,</DIV><DIV>Fred Sturm</DIV><DIV>University of New Mexico</DIV><DIV><A href="mailto:fssturm@unm.edu">fssturm@unm.edu</A></DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"></SPAN></SPAN> </DIV><BR><DIV><DIV>On May 19, 2006, at 10:25 AM, Jeff Tanner wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><BR><DIV><DIV>On May 19, 2006, at 9:30 AM, Fred Sturm wrote:</DIV><BR class="Apple-interchange-newline"><BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><DIV style="margin-top: 0px; margin-right: 0px; margin-bottom: 0px; margin-left: 0px; "><FONT face="Helvetica" size="3" style="font: 12.0px Helvetica">BTW, I have been installing undercovers now with hooks and grommets.<SPAN class="Apple-converted-space"> </SPAN></FONT></DIV> </BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR><DIV>Hey, Fred,</DIV><DIV>Thanks for the info on the data loggers. I'll check it out. I'd been thinking about hooks and grommets. What kind of hooks are you using? And how have your duct tape "grommets" held up over time?</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>I've also thought about snaps -- like on your (non-button-fly) jeans or a denim jacket. They would install pretty much the same way as grommets and hooks. They've been used for vertical lid snaps in the past also. I know they buzz when they are not engaged, but they shouldn't when engaged. I just haven't had the chance to go to a decent sewing store to find any.</DIV><DIV><BR class="khtml-block-placeholder"></DIV><DIV>Jeff</DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV><BR></DIV></BODY></HTML>