<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceName"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceType"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="City"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="place"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PersonName"/>  <style>  </style> </head> <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue style='word-wrap: break-word;-khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space'> <div class=Section1> Thanks to all.  I had two different versions and wanted to get an authoritative check.  I had entered (apparently incorrectly) a version into my pocket RCT, because Dean doesn’t seem to include it in the standard HTs.  But since, as you all collectively pointed out, Dave Carpenter’s version gibes with Jason Kanter’s, that’s good enough for me.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> It just seemed like it had to be _somewhere_ in Tuning.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Thanks for the additional sources and aural instructions.  I should now be considered armed and historically dangerous.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lawrence</st1:place></st1:City> Becker, RPT<o:p></o:p> Piano Technician<o:p></o:p> College-Conservatory of Music<o:p></o:p> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Cincinnati</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> </div> From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of Fred Sturm Sent: Tuesday, August 15, 2006 6:51 PM To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> Subject: Re: [CAUT] Werkmeister in Jorgensen<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p>             Strangely this very common temperament doesn't seem to be in Jorgenson's Tuning (sometimes his indexing can be frustrating, so I could have missed it). However, I'll confirm the figures Ken gives based on a couple other sources. Interestingly, Chip Miller's web site (Chip worked with Avery Todd on temperament stuff, and did an amazing compilation of temperament offsets at <a href="http://www.pianolit.com/tuning/">http://www.pianolit.com/tuning/</a>) has completely different figures. I have found his stuff very accurate until this one. Chip lists his source as Barbour (J Murray, Tuning and Temperaments) which seems to have disappeared from our library.  Hmmm, always check everything. Someone made a mistake, between Chip and J Murray I think. Another good website for temperament offsets is <a href="http://www.katsurashareware.com/temperaments/temperaments.html">http://www.katsurashareware.com/temperaments/temperaments.html</a>.<o:p></o:p> <div>             While looking on the shelf (I badly needed a break from pitch lowering) I ran across a new book on the topic, A Guide to Musical Temperament, by Thomas Donahue, Scare Crow Press, 2005. Looks like a great reference book. Well-organized, and lots of background information and the data needed to figure things out yourself if you are so inclined.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             Aural instructions, minimized:<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> CF, FA#, A#D#, D#G#,G#C#, C#F# all pure 5ths or 4ths. FA 2 bps. AE pure. EB pure (which makes BF# wide 2 bps). You've got D and G left to tune. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Tune DA wide P4 about 2 bps. GD narrow P5 1.5 bps, and CG should be wide P4 2 bps. Check FA, CE, DA, GD, CG, BF# all beat about the same (1.5 to 2 bps).<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             It's a very simple temperament, with 8 pure 5th/4ths, 4 tempered ones. Tune pure 4th/5ths down through the circle of 5ths from C to F#, then a wide tempered 4th to B, then two more pure 4th/5ths, then three wide/narrow tempered. <o:p></o:p> <div> <div> Regards,<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Fred Sturm<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">New Mexico</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <a href="mailto:fssturm@unm.edu">fssturm@unm.edu</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> On Aug 15, 2006, at 2:37 PM, Jeff Tanner wrote:<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> These are also in Appendix B of the SAT III Operating Manual, except rounded to one decimal point.  Temperament 13 is preprogrammed to Werckmeister with the same offsets below.<o:p></o:p> <div> Jeff T<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> On Aug 15, 2006, at 3:28 PM, Ken Zahringer wrote:<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> I don’t have Tuning, but the Werckmeister III is in my Verituner, and Dave Carpenter said he got all his data from Jorgensen.  The offsets I have are: A   0.00 A#  +7.82 B   +3.91 C   +11.73 C#  +1.96 D   +3.91 D#  +5.87 E   +1.96 F   +9.78 F#  0.00 G   +7.82 G#  +3.91 Hope this helps, Ken Z. On 8/15/06 1:12 PM, "<st1:PersonName w:st="on">Becker, <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lawrence</st1:place></st1:City></st1:PersonName> (beckerlr)" <<a href="mailto:BECKERLR@UCMAIL.UC.EDU">BECKERLR@UCMAIL.UC.EDU</a>> wrote: <o:p></o:p> Does anyone know if Jorgensen gives instructions and/or offsets for tuning Werkmeister III in Tuning?  I can’t find it from the indices.   Thanks in advance   <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Lawrence</st1:place></st1:City> Becker, RPT Piano Technician College-Conservatory of Music <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Cincinnati</st1:PlaceName></st1:place> <o:p></o:p> -- Ken Zahringer, RPT Piano Technician MU <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">School</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Music</st1:PlaceName></st1:place> 297 Fine Arts 882-1202 cell 489-7529<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> </div> </div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> </div> </body> </html>