<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="country-region"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceName"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PlaceType"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="place"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PersonName"/>  <style>  </style> </head> <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue style='word-wrap: break-word;-khtml-nbsp-mode: space; -khtml-line-break: after-white-space'> <div class=Section1> Thomas,<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> I seem to be the only one who likes Hellerbass. I also like Arledge but Hellerbass actually gets the strings to me in less time than Arledge and they’re as good as Arledge, IMO. A string broke on Tuesday and Hellerbass had it to me clear from <st1:country-region w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Germany</st1:place></st1:country-region> in 2 days! Arledge took nearly 6 weeks for the same thing. I know that isn’t typical for Arledge but it has taken at least two weeks for them.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Jim Busby BYU<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> </div> From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of Thomas Russell Sent: Tuesday, December 05, 2006 12:18 PM To: caut@ptg.org Subject: Re: [CAUT] Re-stringing Steinway D<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> Thanks for all the input on restringing and pinblocks.  A couple responders indicated that they use Arledge bass strings.  Any other opinions on using something other than Steinway bass strings?<o:p></o:p> <div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> Thomas Russell<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> On Dec 5, 2006, at 1:00 PM, <a href="mailto:caut-request@ptg.org">caut-request@ptg.org</a> wrote:<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> <div> Send caut mailing list submissions to<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             <a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             <a href="https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives">https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             <a href="mailto:caut-request@ptg.org">caut-request@ptg.org</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> You can reach the person managing the list at<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>             <a href="mailto:caut-owner@ptg.org">caut-owner@ptg.org</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> than "Re: Contents of caut digest..."<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Today's Topics:<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div>    1. Re: re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation (Jeff Tanner)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>    2.  Wapin Seminar Report (RicB)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>    3.   Wapin Seminar Report (RicB)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>    4. Re: re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation (Ken Zahringer)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>    5. Re: re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation (Jeff Tanner)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt;min-height: 17px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt'> From: Jeff Tanner <<a href="mailto:jtanner@mozart.sc.edu">jtanner@mozart.sc.edu</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:30.0pt'> Date: December 4, 2006 3:33:06 PM CST<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:20.25pt'> To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:45.75pt'> Subject: Re: [CAUT] re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:53.25pt'> Reply-To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> <div> <div> On Dec 4, 2006, at 3:29 PM, Jim Busby wrote:<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> Jeff,<O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "></O:P><o:p></o:p> <O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "> </O:P><o:p></o:p> Even with new agraffes I would still do the Paul Revenko-Jones’ polishing. Since doing that it has made a big difference on our pianos. (Much less buzzing, rattling annoyances, etc.)<O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "></O:P><o:p></o:p> <O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "> </O:P><o:p></o:p> Jim Busby BYU<O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "></O:P><o:p></o:p> <O:P style="color: rgb(0, 0, 128); font-family: Arial; font-size: 13.3333px; "> </O:P><o:p></o:p> </div> No argument with that.  I'm just amazed that any tone at all was able to be produced by some of the junk agraffes I've been finding in our Steinways from the late 60s and early 70s.  Unfortunately, I don't have a way of taking a pictures.  Few were drilled in a straight line.  Many have no bevel in the hole at all -- just drilled straight through.  A reamer and flitz won't do much for that.   It's $186 (D) and a couple hours or so well spent to replace them.<o:p></o:p> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> </div> <div> <div> Jeff Tanner, RPT<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">South Carolina</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt;min-height: 17px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt'> From: RicB <<a href="mailto:ricb@pianostemmer.no">ricb@pianostemmer.no</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:30.0pt'> Date: December 4, 2006 3:50:08 PM CST<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:20.25pt'> To: <a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:45.75pt'> Subject: [CAUT]  Wapin Seminar Report<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:53.25pt'> Reply-To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Hi Tim<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Thanks muchly for your detailed and complete report.  I did'nt want to get into hyping Wapin all that much ahead of time when you brought this up last time, but to be sure I had rather expected you would return with an enthusiastic report. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Much of the skepticism directed against Wapin has to do with what basically comes down to head scratching, or so it seems often enough to me.  When it comes down to it tho, observation is one thing and being able to what is observed is really quite another.  We can wonder all day long just how Wapin does what it does....  but it really is not so difficult or time consuming to confirm it has a <<profound>> as you put it affect. All one needs is an open mind and a healthy portion of curiosity.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> In any case, your experience echoes my own.  And frankly when I stop to think of it.... I have a hard time imagining why rearranging the bridge pins in the fashion would/could  not have a profound effect.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> I still have some questions that I'd like to see (dispassionately) discussed thats for sure, but as the song goes... I'm a believer. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Thanks again.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Cheers<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> RicB<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt;min-height: 17px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt'> From: RicB <<a href="mailto:ricb@pianostemmer.no">ricb@pianostemmer.no</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:30.0pt'> Date: December 4, 2006 3:52:06 PM CST<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:20.25pt'> To: <a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:45.75pt'> Subject: [CAUT]   Wapin Seminar Report<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:53.25pt'> Reply-To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Grin... sxuse me... that last post should have been addressed to  Mark, and not Tim of course.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Cheers<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> RicB<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt;min-height: 17px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt'> From: Ken Zahringer <<a href="mailto:ZahringerK@missouri.edu">ZahringerK@missouri.edu</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:30.0pt'> Date: December 4, 2006 5:11:06 PM CST<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:20.25pt'> To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:45.75pt'> Subject: Re: [CAUT] re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:53.25pt'> Reply-To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> That’s interesting, Jeff.  Maybe the mode of removal doesn’t make as much difference as I thought.  I have restrung without replacing the block only twice in the last 10 years or so, and both times I didn’t handle the pins until I had backed them all out, by which time they had apparently cooled off.  Both pianos still tune great, though.  There’s always something to learn out there. Ken Z. On 12/4/06 2:14 PM, "Jeff Tanner" <<a href="mailto:jtanner@mozart.sc.edu">jtanner@mozart.sc.edu</a>> wrote:<o:p></o:p> On Dec 2, 2006, at 12:19 PM, Ken Zahringer wrote:<o:p></o:p> If you’re absolutely committed to keeping the original block, here’s my two cents worth:<o:p></o:p> <ol start=1 type=1> <li class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto; mso-list:l0 level1 lfo1'>Remove the old pins with a brace or ratchet, not an electric drill.  It’s more work, but it keeps the heat down and won’t glaze the hole.<o:p></o:p></li> </ol> Ken, I'll have to take issue with this.  Another technician here showed me exactly the opposite just recently.  Removing the pins with a brace (or even a T-stringing hammer) got the pins so hot you couldn't hold them.  The electric drill didn't give them time to get hot.  They were warm, but you could hold them. Jeff   Jeff Tanner, RPT <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">South Carolina</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p> -- Ken Zahringer, RPT Piano Technician MU <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">School</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">Music</st1:PlaceName></st1:place> 297 Fine Arts 882-1202 cell 489-7529<o:p></o:p> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt;min-height: 17px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:33.0pt'> From: Jeff Tanner <<a href="mailto:jtanner@mozart.sc.edu">jtanner@mozart.sc.edu</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:30.0pt'> Date: December 5, 2006 10:48:06 AM CST<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:20.25pt'> To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:45.75pt'> Subject: Re: [CAUT] re-stringing Steinway D: pinblock preparation<o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='margin-left:53.25pt'> Reply-To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">College and University Technicians</st1:PersonName> <<a href="mailto:caut@ptg.org">caut@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div style='min-height: 14px'> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> On Dec 4, 2006, at 6:11 PM, Ken Zahringer wrote:<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> That’s interesting, Jeff.  Maybe the mode of removal doesn’t make as much difference as I thought.  I have restrung without replacing the block only twice in the last 10 years or so, and both times I didn’t handle the pins until I had backed them all out, by which time they had apparently cooled off.  Both pianos still tune great, though.  There’s always something to learn out there. Ken Z.<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> We have 18 Steinway grands from the late 60's to 1978.  All the blocks are fine - in many cases better than many of our '94 models, but in our mostly humid environment we have some badly corroded wire.  Also, inadequate budgets, lack of space and proper tools don't allow for pinblock replacements right now, so we have to get as much bang for our buck as we can and restring with larger pins.  (I don't know if having only 1 Steinway that predates teflon makes us more or less fortunate.)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> Yes, I would have thought the electric drill would have created more heat.  I'd always backed the pins out with hand tools before.  But the high speed drill backed them out in a fraction of a second each.  There simply wasn't time for the friction to create as much heat.  On the other hand, if it had been a slower speed drill, I expect the temp would have been higher.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <div> I learned something too!<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Jeff<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div> Jeff Tanner, RPT<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <st1:place w:st="on"><st1:PlaceType w:st="on">University</st1:PlaceType> of <st1:PlaceName w:st="on">South Carolina</st1:PlaceName></st1:place><o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> <o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> _______________________________________________<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> caut list info: <a href="https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives">https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives</a><o:p></o:p> </div> </div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> </div> </body> </html>