Hi Marcel, I have had a lot of store experience with Chinese-made Korean pianos in the past.  They were all like this you describe.  Case parts also were so askew that remounting them was a common thing.  It suprised me, too, that with as much profit these stores make off the pianos, they still refuse to have any of them properly prepped.  "just tune it and ship it!", was their motto.  Even more suprising was the frequency of customers requesting the piano be unboxed at their homes! (making sure they are not getting the "used" floor model, I guess).  Man, I sure don't miss those days in the slightest!!! Best, Paul <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td width=40%>Marcel Carey <mcpiano@videotron.ca> Sent by: caut-bounces@ptg.org 01/09/2007 03:40 PM <table border> <tr valign=top> <td bgcolor=white> <div align=center>Please respond to College and University Technicians <caut@ptg.org></div></table> <td width=59%> <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>To</div> <td>staples.13@osu.edu, "'College and University Technicians'" <caut@ptg.org> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>cc</div> <td> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>Subject</div> <td>[CAUT] RE :  huge pitch raise question</table> <table> <tr valign=top> <td> <td></table> </table> <tt>Hello Michelle, I just did a chinese import this afternoon. The piano had been delivered in the crate last may. There were still some kind of paper pattern stuck to the bass struts and the paper was touching some bass strings. WOW, what a sound. Now I would like to ask you if the string breakage you experience is with these chinese imports. The reason I ask is that this particular piano scared me. The first tenor strings had so much angle up from the V-bar that they just didn't want to move. I thought of your post and I had a lot of cranking up before the pitch actually started to change. I didn't measure the angle, but it looked like 30 or more degrees. I was lucky, nothing broke but the piano was a beast to bring back to pitch and tune. The pins were tight and springy. Not fun but the pay is good. But it upsets me that some store send pianos in crates with NO PREPARATION whatsoever. Marcel Carey, RPT Sherbrooke, QC > > > Hi folks- > > Happy New Year! > > :D > > It happens more often than I'd like (and once is enough to be > honest) and while I "feel"  that it's not my lovely hammer > technique ;)  , maybe it's something to do with some sort of > "string thing".. > > Has anyone else run across this? > (Or maybe a PTG article I have overlooked?) > > Upon visiting a fairly new piano and finding it dreadfully > flat (50 cents or more) , I carefully yet quickly, raise it > up at least half of what it was. And I do have a (good?) > habit of initially moving the pin in the flat direction > before moving it sharp in order to loosen any friction from > any rust or whatever that may have accumulated. Just a > *quick* jerk to the left- nothing serious at all. > > Now.. having raised the piano up (with a second pass to at > least get it up to pitch) I start doing a "fine tuning". > > it is either at this second pass or my fine tuning where > strings start to break. In the usual places too- nothing out > of the ordinary. > > (Am I doing "too many tunings" (up to 3  times) to raise this > completely up? Seems like that wouldn't be an issue,   > especially if it's new(er)? Have I introduced some sort of > unusual friction/heat or something?? > > > Now this doesn't happen all of the time, but I am acutely > aware that it could and I wonder if there's something in my > technique or my sequence of pitch raising that makes these > newer strings break. (I could understand some strings > breaking if the piano was older..) > > I know tuners who on the first go, bring the whole piano up > tp pitch but I've always been a little leary of that. I'm > wondering if they also have strings break on their second > pass/ fine tuning.. > > I fully realize that they (the strings) are now at different > spots on all of the contact and termination points so I would > assume that would add to the puzzle. And I'd like to also add > that it seems that the tork alone on this 1/2 way-to-pitch, > pitch raised piano feels MUCH higher than it did before (and > more than "normal") and I chalk that up to the higher tension > I have just introduced. > > I am a jerk tuner. > > (Stop laughing  :) > > I would be VERY interested in viewing the number of passes > you folks do to bring a  piano up to pitch and whether or not > you've experienced this-especially on ones that aren't so old. > > Hope this post reads OK- and I look forward to your responses! > > :) > Michelle > > > > > > > > > > > > </tt>