David and Jim, I have the step by step instructions to install one in a Steinway D.  Would you like me to post it? Paul <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td width=40%>Jim Busby <jim_busby@byu.edu> Sent by: caut-bounces@ptg.org 01/31/2008 01:33 PM <table border> <tr valign=top> <td bgcolor=white> <div align=center>Please respond to College and University Technicians <caut@ptg.org></div></table> <td width=59%> <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>To</div> <td>College and University Technicians <caut@ptg.org> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>cc</div> <td> <tr valign=top> <td> <div align=right>Subject</div> <td>Re: [CAUT] Natural key width</table> <table> <tr valign=top> <td> <td></table> </table> <tt>David, I used to have the "step by step" instructions as to how to fit it to the piano. He said we could share that, if anyone was interested, but I guess I deleted it. These instructions and the pictures that go along with them are enlightening. It might answer some of the questions here. Regards, Jim Busby -----Original Message----- From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of Porritt, David Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 5:50 AM To: Ed Sutton; College and University Technicians Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width Well, you could easily spend a day on it.  When Tom Servinsky brought it here when it was new, he spent two days.  Since that initial set-up and regulation I'd suppose the routine stuff would amount to a day.  David Steinbuhler was the one who did the regulation/set-up last summer when it went to Chicago for a piano teacher's convention.  I'm suggest that anyone seriously curious about all this write him at dskeyboards@tbscc.com and ask.  He continues to develop the action and I'm sure he has made a few innovations since he made the action we have. He is a serious innovator.  Check out http://www.steinbuhler.com/ dave David M. Porritt, RPT dporritt@smu.edu -----Original Message----- From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of Ed Sutton Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 6:18 AM To: College and University Technicians Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width All told, this amounts to a regulation, or at least regulation touch-up, after fitting the action to the piano, including spacing hammers and also key tails to the damper levers, and sostenuto regulation. Also fitting hammers to strings and voicing? How long does it take? How much should a technician expect to be paid for doing this? Do they really expect a concert level regulation: close let off, even dip and aftertouch? (I see a potential for a serious disjunction between what a performer expects to pay and the work that is expected of the technician.) Ed Sutton ----- Original Message ----- From: "Porritt, David" <dporritt@mail.smu.edu> To: <ilvey@sbcglobal.net>; "College and University Technicians" <caut@ptg.org> Sent: Wednesday, January 30, 2008 7:01 AM Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width > David: > > Renner shanks, flanges etc. Renner wippens Ronsen Wurzen hammers. > > I should have mentioned in the last post that all adjustments are done > to the action so that nothing has to be done to the piano.  When you > pull the 7/8 action out and replace it with the piano's native action > nothing has to be changed back. > > dp > > David M. Porritt, RPT > dporritt@smu.edu > > -----Original Message----- > From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of > David Ilvedson > Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 9:51 PM > To: caut@ptg.org > Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width > > What hammers is he using?   Renner parts...? > > David Ilvedson, RPT > Pacifica, CA  94044 > > ----- Original message ---------------------------------------- > From: "Porritt, David" <dporritt@mail.smu.edu> > To: "College and University Technicians" <caut@ptg.org> > Received: 1/29/2008 9:49:32 AM > Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width > > >>Fred: > >>When David Steinbuhler first said that he was going to make an action > to >>fit any D I suppressed a >>smile as I didn't think it could be done.  A few weeks later the action >>arrived and indeed it can be adapted to fit any D.  There are >>adjustments for damper timing, keyframe bedding, una corda placement, >>everything.  It helps that the action was totally of his manufacture. >>The hammer flange rail is flat so hammer spacing is easy to do, the > pins >>that go under the cheek blocks are fully adjustable in all directions. >>Key bedding is quite ingenious.  I'm very glad now that I didn't say > "it >>can't be done" because he has clearly done it.  The only Steinway >>factory part is the sostenuto rod and that only because it was easier > to >>buy it than to make one.  The rest of the action, brass brackets, > wooden >>rails, key frame etc. are Steinbuhler. > >>One assumes that any venue that has a D and puts on concerts will have >>some arrangement with a technician of some skill.  Generally I'd say >>that any technician who can keep artists happy with a standard D can >>make the adjustments necessary on this action.  The venues where this >>one has been, have been mostly colleges and the resident technicians > had >>no obvious problems making it work well.  We have a box that David made >>for shipping the action that has protected it in transit. > >>I'm sure there will be further development in the action but the > current >>product is a very capable one. > >>dave > >>David M. Porritt, RPT >>dporritt@smu.edu > >>-----Original Message----- >>From: caut-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:caut-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of >>Fred Sturm >>Sent: Tuesday, January 29, 2008 10:55 AM >>To: College and University Technicians >>Subject: Re: [CAUT] Natural key width > >>Hi David, >> I'd be a bit worried taking a keyframe/action assembly with me. > >>First, getting it packed well and having it arrive safe and sound at >>the venue at the other end; and then packed well for the return. But >>second, you would need to be certain there was a tech at the other end > >>capable of doing the work needed. And it _could_ be a lot, depending >>on a lot of factors. For instance, width of keyblocks (might not >>accommodate optimum positioning - S&S keyblocks are custom cut to each > >>piano in the factory, so width is not standard); alignment of hammers >>to strings (capo sections can vary a lot, and agraffes often do as >>well); string height; string level (or out of level); unison spacing >>in the capo sections (individual strings within the trichord - >>especially problematic for una corda voicing). It might work out fine, > >>but it might turn out to be a nightmare, where a less than fully >>competent tech faced a problematic fit. Certainly getting it in >>concert ready condition would need a top notch, efficient tech, at >>least in many cases. And how can a pianist know whether X tech in a >>far away venue is competent in that way? Pretty much a roll of the >>dice in many cases, especially off the beaten path. I guess if it >>became common enough, a grapevine of techs and pianists would develop. >> I suppose going back and forth from 7/8 or 15/16 to full >>wouldn't >>really be any harder than going from violin to viola, probably an >>almost instant adaptation for a decent pianist. It's where I go from a > >>keyboard where I can fairly consistently reach that 10th around the >>edges of the corners of those naturals (without making one of them >>sound a little) to one where it is definitely hit or miss that is more > >>disconcerting. So close and yet so far. Frustrating as all get out. >>Regards, >>Fred Sturm >>University of New Mexico >>fssturm@unm.edu > </tt>