<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><div>On Feb 6, 2008, at 3:54 PM, Kent Swafford wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite">You are mixing tests for some reason, Fred. </blockquote>Yes, sorry about that. I was remembering back to your original post, and responding a bit to it as well. <br><blockquote type="cite">Let me try to ask my question again.<div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>We think of sostenuto as being either on or off. But the mechanism doesn't work that way. A blade rotates up and down over a distance.</div> <div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Should we (and pianists) expect full function in the sostenuto when the blade is rotated down a bit from its maximum height? If so, how far?</div></blockquote>Yes, a bit for comfort. This partly has to do with the speed one has to use in passage work where one needs to change the notes caught. Often this is a really rapid sequence: play the notes to be caught for the next harmony/raise both pedals/lower sostenuto pedal/lower damper pedal/get the fingers to the next notes. All of this happening in a small fraction of a second. So you want a "forgiveness factor" at least for grabbing the damper tabs. Now, I'm not so sure you need as much of one for "not having tabs pass," and the pianist should be expected to keep the pedal fully down from that perspective. But I think it amounts to the same, that in fact there will be some play in the pedal where tabs won't pass if it is regulated so that you can grab tabs in a somewhat large window. </div><div><span class="Apple-tab-span" style="white-space:pre"> </span>This is from a pianist's perspective, from the experience of having movements where I do quite a lot of what I describe above. But I have to add to this that all factors matter: how far up the damper has to be before the sostenuto can grab it, how much the key has to depress before the damper is raised, height and in/out position of the rod, yadda, yadda. There is a relatively small window of what works well. There is give, but only a little. It is possible to regulate a system so that, from the technician's perspective, it works, but from the pianist's perspective it is too unreliable. Of course, if you add those old fixed tabs to the mix, there is an even smaller window.<br><blockquote type="cite"><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"> </div><div>Or should we tell pianists, not to expect to be able to get full function from the sostenuto unless the pedal is fully depressed?</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>And by full function, in this case, I mean the ability to play a double-forte blow without its tab becoming engaged by the sostenuto blade?</div> <div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Kent</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>PS -- You say, "Or play every key hard, but that takes a lot more time and energy."</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"> </div><div>And then you say, "Ain't no shortcuts."</div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div><div>Exactly. 8^) Play each of those keys hard!</div></blockquote>Well, okay, but I have found that if I have visually inspected, have the upstop rail right, and have done the other checking for height of the rod, I never have a problem with dampers passing. So it is redundant for me. Might be a good final check to be sure I wasn't asleep at the wheel, and might have missed the upstop or something, I suppose.<br><blockquote type="cite"><span class="Apple-style-span" style="color: rgb(0, 0, 0); "><div><div style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; "><div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline">Regards,</div><div>Fred Sturm</div><div>University of New Mexico</div><div><a href="mailto:fssturm@unm.edu">fssturm@unm.edu</a></div><div><br class="webkit-block-placeholder"></div></div></div><br><div></div></span> <div>KES<br><div><div></div></div><div><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Feb 6, 2008 3:50 PM, Fred Sturm <<a href="mailto:fssturm@unm.edu">fssturm@unm.edu</a>> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;"> <div class="Ih2E3d"><br>On Feb 3, 2008, at 7:59 AM, Kent Swafford wrote:<br><br>> My tests of the sostenuto were in terms of actual function, that is,<br>> as a player. I can see that might not be sufficient.<br>><br> > I had hoped someone might have an opinion on safety factor in the<br>> depression of the sostenuto pedal. How far could you let up on the<br>> sostenuto pedal and still expect tabs not to slide past on hard blows?<br> ><br>> Kent<br><br></div> I guess I'd say you want to have to let up "a noticeable amount" on<br>the damper pedal before the tabs start to pop (ie, damper pedal down,<br>sostenuto pedal down, let up on damper pedal). That's a pretty wimpy<br> (imprecise) standard , and one you kind of have to work out on your<br>own. The problem is that this symptom (instant popping of tabs, as<br>opposed to however much gap) may reveal a combination of things: could<br>be the rod is away from the tabs too far, could be too high, and could<br> have not enough pedal play (not getting to horizontal), or just a bit<br>of two or all three of the above. But it definitely _is_ a good "one-<br>stop shopper" first step to see if you have problems. Then you go on<br> to find out what the problems are.<br> I guess another wrinkle is to hold the sostenuto at not quite full,<br>and press the damper pedal fully, rapidly and see if some pass. Or<br>play every key hard, but that takes a lot more time and energy. Here,<br> of course, the position of the up-stop comes into play.<br> All things considered, I prefer to go through the regimen I described<br>in my earlier post, as it gives me more information in a more<br>organized way. Bottom line: you need the rod in about as far as it can<br> go safely, you need it to rotate to horizontal, and you need good up/<br>down positioning. And you need to have set the stage with an even line<br>of tabs, good lift from the keys, and good upstop position. Ain't no<br> shortcuts <G>.<br><div><div></div><div class="Wj3C7c"><br>Regards,<br>Fred Sturm<br>University of New Mexico<br><a href="mailto:fssturm@unm.edu">fssturm@unm.edu</a><br><br></div></div></blockquote></div><br></div></div></blockquote></div><br></body></html>