Trouble setting string

[Jon Page]

I want to strengthen the point that when I speak of up or down, I mean
tension.
No pin bending fore 'n aft.

However, a technique which was shown to me by Frank Kast and Jim Daw
(Northern Virginia Chapter) is to 'lock' the hammer on the pin. This is done
with
placing the hammer on the pin, then slightly lifting the hammer until you feel
it
can't be lifted more; then gingerly move the hammer until it registers on the
square
of the pin. Now move the pin. I usually use my little finger for this locking
maneuver.
Uprights are more difficult than grands, but I avoid uprights at all costs
anyway.

Hammer technique is a good subject and no doubt articulated by better tuners
than I.

No one technique works for all pianos but seek and ye shall find.

Regards,

Jon Page

At 02:58 AM 12/25/99 -0600, you wrote:
>> >In a message dated 12/23/1999 10:17:06 AM, Jon wrote:
>> >
>> ><<As with tuning any piano, your last motion with the hammer should be
>'up'>>
>> >
>> >Jon; 
>> >Interesting observation. Care to elucidate? :-)
>> >Jim Bryant (FL)
>
>I almost agree with Jon.  I am finding many times the last motion of the
>pin is "up"
>Hmm I notice he said "hammer"  but I guess "hammer up" means "pin up". 
>Anyhow this is for pianos that render ideally, and after the pin torque or
>turning has been put to rest.   Rendering ideally - means you can pull a
>string up and come down with the pin until it is in tune.  Now the
>important thing is where the pin is  in comming down that the string is in
>tune.  Sometimes the pin is down so far that the spring of it, or flagpole
>effect,  wants to pull it (string) back up.  If this does happen then the
>string is rendering ideally. Another test of ideal rendering is a sharp
>test blow when the pin is "down" that will actually cause the string to
>become sharp. In other words the pin pulled up and caused the string to go
>sharp.   Imagine your little pinkey with a 150 weight attached to it with
>piano wire.  Yes a steel tuning pin half that size has a lot of spring in
>it esp when pulled by 150 to 300 pounds.  
>       Also depending on how you "set the pin" there can be segments above
>and/or below the speaking length, due to friction, at more tension than
>the speaking length.  A sharp blow  can "energise" the string to where
>these segments equalize their tensions. This would give more tension to
>the speaking length and cause it go sharp.  This condition however I
>would/might argue indicates that the string might not be not rendering
>ideally. 
>       So really the last motions of the hammer I use are up and down and up
and
>down in decreasing increments according to how hard the strings render.  
>I like to release the hammer and get the feeling the pin rose up a little,
>and the string is then in tune.   That way if I put the hammer on a pin
>and pull up or down there is not an immediate drop in pitch, at slight
>pressure. 
>       Now there is the "motor cycle throttle"(sp?) effect on the hammer
which
>"bumps" the pin up.  I was shown this by a very good tuner, and saw
>another execllent tuner using it.    But I never seem to have caught on. 
>I seem to be tweeking the pin down for the last movements, feeling that
>the pin pulls back up on its own against the string when I leave it.
>---ricup
>
>Jon writes...
>>There is a series of turning of the pin to raise and lower the
>> tension. Each time
>> the change is less and less until you are just dealing with the torque
>in the
>> pin.
>> I always end this series of pin setting with a nudge to bring the
>tension up.
>> You know,
>> the small, finesse, hammer wobbling to set the pin. With the last motion
>on up
>> tension
>> the string becomes set better as well.
>
>> From: Jon Page <jonpage@mediaone.net>
>> To: pianotech@ptg.org
>> Subject: Re:  Re: Trouble setting string
>> Date: Friday, December 24, 1999 10:56 AM
>> 
>> At 09:57 AM 12/24/99 -0500, you wrote:
>> >
>> >In a message dated 12/23/1999 10:17:06 AM, Jon wrote:
>> >
>> ><<As with tuning any piano, your last motion with the hammer should be
>'up'>>
>> >
>> >Jon; 
>> >Interesting observation. Care to elucidate? :-)
>> >Jim Bryant (FL)
>> > 
>> 
>> As I said before I think the class was given by George Defabaugh
>> in which he demonstrated that the tuning is more stable if the
>> pin to counter-bearing string segment is left with a higher tension
>> by coming up rather than lowering tension to desired tension.
>> 
>  
Jon Page
piano technician; Harwich Port, Cape Cod, Mass.
mailto:jonpage@mediaone.net
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