Pitch raise and Stability

[Billbrpt@AOL.COM]

In a message dated 7/18/00 7:38:48 AM Central Daylight Time, 
LIUB@INTERLOCHEN.K12.MI.US (Baoli Liu) writes:

<< So,a "quick pitch raise" is diffrent from a "slower pitch raise".I
 usually spent a definate time to finish a pitch raise,no break.
 
 The structure of piano  is diffrent from piano to piano,so pitch
 raise (or overpull) should be diffrent. one-fourth is only an
 average  overpull for most pianos,some time it's not enough, some 
 time it  may be too much.
 
 Here  is some of my experince,hope it's a little help to a few
 colleages. (assuming the piano is flat)
 
 new string,more overpull;
 new pinblock,more overpull;
 new soundbord,more overpull;
 loose pin,more overpull;
 the lower bass strings,less overpull;(why? see the location of
 bridge)
 the lower tenor string,less overpull;
 the higer bass string,more overpull;
 above c4 or so,more overpull; >>

I've been following the thread on pitch raising.  Our friend from China has 
produced the best answer yet, in my opinion.

I learned a pitch raise procedure from the late George Defebaugh RPT & Jim 
Coleman RPT over 20 years ago and have used the same basic procedure ever 
since.  I can hardly believe that anyone would go about it in any other way.  
I have tried a few variations of it such as tuning all the A's first, then 
proceeding around the Cycle of 5ths (in order to "load the board more 
evenly") [that makes sense doesn't it?] but have found that nothing works 
better than the usual procedure, done as rapidly as possible.

I agree with those who say that the quicker the pitch raise is done, the 
better the results.  I also agree with this writer's observation that 
different pianos and different areas of the piano respond differently.  
Therefore, no pitch raise calculation can be expected to work perfectly, 
otherwise, you could do a pitch raise and fine tuning in one pass.  Get this 
folks, you can't.  George Defebaugh said so very plainly years ago and he is 
right.  He said, "You can't raise the pitch and fine tune at the same time".  
Believe it, for the truth will set you free.

In the case of a piano which is really 1/2 step low, believing that it will 
only take two passes is just as unrealistic.  If you are lucky and the piano 
you are working with cooperates, tunes easily and the customer is not very 
discriminating, you just may be able to do it in 3 passes.  Otherwise, count 
on 4, or more.

If tuning the piano 4 times in one sitting seems more than you would ever 
care to take on, then the idea that you will have to come back in 2 weeks, a 
month or whatever you tell the customer will certainly be correct because the 
piano won't be in tune when you finish, nor will it be in tune when you come 
back thinking that you can do it only once then.

It all gets down to what you, yourself call "in tune".  Perhaps some of you 
can see what I am getting at when I say that ET is a near impossibility and 
that it is rarely if ever the true result of most people's attempts at tuning 
the piano.  A pitch raise tuning that is left rough and unstable is not in 
"Equal Temperament".  So, even if ET is thought of as the only acceptable way 
to tune the piano the only goal ever attempted by any particular individual, 
unless the piano is really tuned very precisely and left very stable, it 
isn't ET.  And, of course it would not be any other kind of temperament that 
may have been attempted either.

I often think of the number of passes it will take to tune well and leave the 
piano stable the way the difficulty of a golf course is rated as a "par".  In 
almost no circumstance is it possible to have a "hole in one".  Even 10 cents 
in a concert or high profile situation requires 3 passes.  20 cents 
absolutely requires 3 passes.  Anything beyond 50 cents will take 4 passes.  
A 1/2 step or more is an extreme amount in any circumstance.  If it is 
somebody's old upright or a neglected console, the 4 pass tuning may be good 
enough for that customer until the next time it might be appropriate to tune, 
6-12 months later.

But realistically, a piano being changed that much will require 4 passes just 
to get it into tune and follow up service again soon, depending on the 
sensitivity of the user.  It is important to try to determine why the piano 
was allowed to be that much out of tune and whether there is any structural 
failure that may have contributed to the low pitch.  In such a case, it would 
not be a good idea to try to establish standard pitch just for the sake of 
doing so.  It would be better to tune the piano at a level to which it is 
"comfortable".

Developing Speed & Accuracy is important.  It should be possible to tune 4 
passes on a piano in under 90 minutes.  If it takes 90 minutes just to do one 
pass, then it would be a good idea to try to figure out why it is taking so 
long to do what others can do in a a fraction of that amount of time.

Bill Bremmer RPT
Madison, Wisconsin