Pitchlist - WAS: Re: Old Bosie

[Jean-Jacques Granas]

Hey,

Just to prove you right William, your comment about being a closet
organologist brings to mind a joke of my former music professor that I just
can't resist sharing with you: He told us, a group of 20 pubescent and
precarious boys, that the organist he was going to introduce to us that day
is someone who plays the organ, not someone who plays with ....
As consolation, please take heart in that you're an organologist, which
would seem to indicate you study the thing. Organists, on the other hand are
full fledged practionners and, as such, perhaps had better remain in the
closet during practice sessions.

Cheers

jj


----- Original Message -----
From: "William R. Brohinsky" <onlyocelot@joimail.com>
To: "Pianotech" <pianotech@ptg.org>
Sent: Tuesday, January 06, 2004 6:21 PM
Subject: Re: Pitchlist - WAS: Re: Old Bosie


> Hi!
>
> I've been lurking, I admit. But I've been a closet organologist (someone
> is bound to say _something_ to that, I know) for over 30 years. So this
> is a subject that I can address more securely than regulation or repair,
> which I'm learning now.
>
> Anyway, Conrad's loverly list reminded me that I have a copy of
> Helmholtz on the shelf over my bench. This is the Dover edition of the
> 3rd edition, "with a new appendix bringing information down to 1885".
> The appendix, compiled by Ellis (english translator of the book, which
> is titled "On the Sensations of Tone as a physiological basis for the
> theory of music"), also contains a list like Conrad's, although more
> extensive and with Hz to tenths. His lowest is a=373.1, calculated by
> Ellis from an earlier calculation by Delezenne from measurements of an
> open organ pipe presumed to be c. (Say that in one breath, I dare you!)
> A more "bona fide" lowest measured a is a=373.7, a measurement made by
> Ellis himself from a "model after Mersenne".
>
> At the other end of the spectrum, lies a=567.3, which is, indeed,
> Praetorius' North German church pitch, inferred as a fourth over
> "suitable pitch", a=424.2 taken in meantone.
>
> Ellis gives more valuable info to this list interspersed in the second
> version of this table, which is organized by country, then category. I
> extract liberally:
>
> I. Austro-Hungary
> 7. pianofortes
> 1780     Vienna     Stein, for Mozart    a=421.6
> 1862     Vienna     Esse, per Naeke    454.0
> 1862     Vienna     Proch                     445
> II. Belgium
> (no listing)
> III. England, Scotland and Ireland
> 7. pianofortes
> 1826    London     Broadwood's lowest    433.0
> 1849-1854               medium                    445.9
> 1854p                       copy now used        446.2
> 1860                         copy made for         445.5
>                                  society of arts
> 1852-1874                highest(?)                452.5
> 1874p                       present highest         454.7
> 1846a                   Hipkins' Vocal pitch (meantone)   433.5
> 1846p                   Hipkins' Vocal (equal temperament) 436.0
> 1877                     Collard                         449.9
> 1879                     Erard                            455.3
> 1879                     Steinway (in England)    454.7
> 1877                     Chappell                        455.9
> IV. France
> 7. pianofortes, Spinets, Etc.
> 1648    Mersenne's Spinet     402.9
> 1713    Sauveur                     406.6
> 1783    Pascal Taskin            409.0
> 1829    Piano of Opera          425.5
> 1836     Wolfel's                    443.3
> V. Germany
> 9. instruments
> 1776 Breslau     Marpurg    414.4  (included because of the lack of
> explicet pianoforte listings)
> VI. Holland
> (comment that all the organs have been altered, and their original
> pitches were not recovered, and then no listings for pianofortes at all)
> VII. Italy
> 7, pianofortes
> 1839    Bologna    Tadolini's fork    425.8
>
> The highest of these is the present Chappell tuning (well, present then)
> of 455.9. For 1879, in England, the Steinway listed at a=454.7 matches
> the 'present' listing for Broadwood. Conrad's listing of 457 for an
> American Steinway is both later than this and higher. The serial number
> on the Bosie that started this discussion was 1877, though, so it may be
> that this is at least a useful datapoint for the discussion?
>
> raybro
> (aka Ray Brohinsky, since it's not considered etiquettically sympatico
> to hide behind name concatations.)
>
> Don wrote:
>
> >Hi Conrad,
> >
> >My what nice research! Do you happen to remember what the highest pitch
for
> >a piano was? I see Steinway was 457+ but was anyone ever higher?
> >
> >Regards,
> >Don Rose, B.Mus., A.M.U.S., A.MUS., R.P.T.
> >
> >mailto:pianotuna@accesscomm.ca
> >http://us.geocities.com/drpt1948/
> >
> >3004 Grant Rd.
> >REGINA, SK
> >S4S 5G7
> >306-352-3620 or 1-888-29t-uner
> >_______________________________________________
> >pianotech list info: https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives
> >
> >
> >
>
>
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>