[pianotech] Fw: Temperaments

Pianoman pianoman at accessus.net
Sat Dec 13 11:34:11 PST 2008


My previous post about temperaments was supposed to go to the pipe organ 
list which is currently having a aural tuning is best discussion. Sorry,
James
James Grebe
Since 1962
Piano Tuning & Repair
Creator of Handsome Hardwood Products(
314) 608-4137   1526 Raspberry Lane   Arnold, MO 63010
Researcher of St. Louis Theatre History
BECOME WHAT YOU BELIEVE!
www.grebepiano.com
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Pianoman" <pianoman at accessus.net>
To: "Pianotech" <pianotech at ptg.org>
Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 9:32 AM
Subject: [pianotech] Fw: Temperaments


>
> James Grebe
> Since 1962
> Piano Tuning & Repair
> Creator of Handsome Hardwood Products(
> 314) 608-4137   1526 Raspberry Lane   Arnold, MO 63010
> Researcher of St. Louis Theatre History
> BECOME WHAT YOU BELIEVE!
> www.grebepiano.com
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Pianoman" <pianoman at accessus.net>
> To: "Michael Johnston" <michael at MICHAELSMUSICSERVICE.COM>
> Sent: Saturday, December 13, 2008 9:31 AM
> Subject: Re: Temperaments
>
>
>>     Speaking as a piano tuner  as my profession, 46 years and counting: I 
>> tuned the first 18 years of my career (1962 to 1980) aurally.  The 
>> electronic and then later, computer devices, came into being, each being 
>> more mathematically correct as time went on.  These are devices are made 
>> solely for the purpose of tuning pianos and have an accuracy of 0.05 
>> cents. They have the ability to measure and set up to the 8th partial. 
>> The one I have been using for the past 20 years is the Sanderson 
>> Acc-Tuner III.   I have found, in my experience, that a person may be 
>> able to do a extremely accurate piano tuning aurally if you have an 
>> unusually long period of time at a instrument that is stable in pitch to 
>> begin with.  My emphasis is on the word "may".  With the device, it is 
>> possible to do a very good job with a tuning on 99.9% of all the pianos 
>> out there.  In many cases you can do a better job because the tuning will 
>> be more uniform across the board rather than changing parameters in 
>> different places in the registers due to changing inharmonicity.  There 
>> is NO perfect piano that behaves in a theoretically perfect manner and 
>> whatever way we tune the piano it is a compromise somewhere.  Indeed, the 
>> whole tuning is a compromise.  I tune instruments ranging from 9' concert 
>> grands to lowly cheap spinets and I have the ability to tune aurally or 
>> with the computer either way and adjust the tuning to favor aurally or by 
>> computer.  I have come to the conclusion that the method I prefer is with 
>> the computer tuning device that I use. I have also used another competing 
>> device (Reyburn Cyber-Tuner) and though the final tuning is not the same 
>> as with the Accu-Tuner, or aurally, it is just as correct as the other 
>> two methods.  Bottom line is the device is just a device and it is the 
>> person who uses it  that determines whether the tuning is a success or 
>> not.  At the same time the machines have a memory so a tuning for a 
>> particular piano can be stored and you can duplicate the tuning time 
>> after time on that particular piano. By the way the machines also have 
>> built in choice of other temperaments so they are useful in that area as 
>> well.  If a person has all the time in the world you can do a wonderful 
>> piano tuning aurally, if you have a good piano.  On the same token you 
>> can do a wonderful job on a good piano with the accurate device and a 
>> person who is well skilled in using it in a much shorter period of time.
>> Just my humble opinion.
>> James
>> James Grebe
>> Since 1962
>> Piano Tuning & Repair
>> Creator of Handsome Hardwood Products(
>> 314) 608-4137   1526 Raspberry Lane   Arnold, MO 63010
>> Researcher of St. Louis Theatre History
>> BECOME WHAT YOU BELIEVE!
>> www.grebepiano.com
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Michael Johnston" <michael at MICHAELSMUSICSERVICE.COM>
>> To: <PIPORG-L at listserv.albany.edu>
>> Sent: Friday, December 12, 2008 6:26 PM
>> Subject: Re: Temperaments
>>
>>
>>>> The first time I encountered a tuner who used an electrobox.
>>>
>>> I know several organ builders and organ techs who provide maintainance. 
>>> I studied piano tuning with three old men, long since dead. Not one of 
>>> them used an electric device. Most started with a tuning fork and went 
>>> from there.
>>>
>>> I know that I'm not good at it. After one octave, my brains are mush and 
>>> I'm ready for martinis. I have spent hours watching tuners at work and 
>>> marveled at their ability and tolerance. I've seen big high pressure 
>>> reeds being tuned where the tuner wore ear protection. I've seen Dennis 
>>> McGurk work on the ACCH organ. I've seen the subtle tuning of the W-S 
>>> Tannenberg [subtle quiet tracker]. Not one of them has used an 
>>> electronic device except as a starting point, and most start with a 
>>> fork.
>>>
>>> Are there those who use the electronic box to match pitch to every 
>>> single pipe? That would be surprising to me because wouldn't it take a 
>>> whole lot more time? I was taught beat counting, and wouldn't that 
>>> obviate this entirely?
>>>
>>> Cheers!
>>> Michael
>>> -- 
>>> MICHAEL'S  MUSIC  SERVICE   4146 Sheridan Dr, Charlotte, NC 28205
>>> 704-567-1066   ** Please call or email us for your organ needs **
>>> http://michaelsmusicservice.com    "Organ Music Is Our Specialty"
>>>
>>> ::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::::
>>> Note:  opinions  expressed on PIPORG-L are those of the  individual con-
>>> tributors and not necessarily  those of the list owners  nor of the Uni-
>>> versity at Albany.  For a brief  summary of list  commands, send mail to
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>>>
>>
>
>
>
> 





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