Anecdotal information is difficult to draw conclusions from but I have countless pianos come through my shop annually and I follow all of them to the customer's home--95% Steinway pianos. They get knocked down with the lyre with a heavy blanket underneath to rock the piano over (that's how my mover does it) unless it's a Louis or something else where the lyre is very fragile. When I get to the customer's home I just don't find any problems with bedding, regulation or anything else associated with the move. Changes in temperature and humidity from my shop environment to their home environment can cause some tuning issues but since they pianos are often newly strung it's difficult to separate that out. Other than that I just don't see problems. David Love www.davidlovepianos.com -----Original Message----- From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of William Truitt Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 9:01 AM To: pianotech at ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage Hi Ron: I think it would be fair to say, that unless you see the perps committing the atrocities to the keybed, the evidence is going to be indirect and anecdotal. That said, I do remember one German Steinway C that was housed in a large facility and concertized on regularly. I tuned it often, and cared for its needs for regulation and voicing. As such I had a pretty good idea of the levelness of the keybed before the move, and afterwards. Where the bed had been flat and the frame bedded before the move, it was not flat and the frame floating at the ends afterwards. I did not see the move, but did know that the movers had set the piano on the lyre as part of the move (I asked them later). My guess is that they had set it down roughly, and that had caused the distortion. If you take the lyre out the equation as part of your teardown process, it is not possible to set it down roughly and damage the keybed. My mover, who does about 1,000 to 1,500 pianos a year, often does the following: He removes the lyre, and sits in a chair in front of the keybed as close as possible to the bass end. His helper lifts the bass end and sets it down on the chaired movers knees after he has slid them under the keybed. His knees are open 6 to 12 inches during this process. The piano is then sitting high enough that the helper can with some leisure remove the bass leg, after which point they position they skid board underneath to then lower the piano onto it from there. Set up reverses this process. I have seen him do this with concert grands too. These are full time professional movers who work very quickly and safely, and I have learned a lot from peeking over their shoulder. They work smart, not hard. You could say there are old piano movers and there are dumb piano movers, but that there are no old, dumb piano movers. To what other possible causal agents would you possibly attribute the upward distortion of the keybed that we so often see? I am sure there must be others, but I remain of the belief that setting the piano on the lyre can be one of them. Will -----Original Message----- From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On Behalf Of Ron Nossaman Sent: Thursday, November 26, 2009 11:08 AM To: pianotech at ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] Lyre Damage Porritt, David wrote: >> I've said many times that the >> lyre is meant for hanging and the keybed cannot or should not take the >> weight of supporting the piano even temporarily > > You mean, like sitting on the piano horse - on the key bed? > Ron N > > But the piano horse distributes that same weight across the whole key bed rather than a few square inches above the lyre. Quite so. I'm curious though. Have any of you found action problems you could attribute directly to setting a piano up on the lyre? Any actual evidence of key bed damage from this? I never have, but there are still an infinity of places I haven't been. So I was wondering if this is real, or yet another of those "intuitive" things. I know broken lyres and crushed corners on bottom plates are real, I'm just wondering where all this concern for the key bed comes from. Ron N
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