Another succinct but mysterious post from the Wall...who is that masked man? David Ilvedson, RPT Pacifica, CA 94044 ----- Original message ---------------------------------------- From: "robert wall" <robertemmett.w at gmail.com> To: pianotech at ptg.org Received: 2/1/2010 10:45:09 AM Subject: Re: [pianotech] pianotech Digest, Vol 16, Issue 2 >Im sick of this if the "concert Technician" said the pins were fine, have >him tune it.Robert E. Wall St.LouisU.S.A. >On Mon, Feb 1, 2010 at 8:42 AM, <pianotech-request at ptg.org> wrote: >> Send pianotech mailing list submissions to >> pianotech at ptg.org >> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit >> http://ptg.org/mailman/listinfo/pianotech >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to >> pianotech-request at ptg.org >> >> You can reach the person managing the list at >> pianotech-owner at ptg.org >> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific >> than "Re: Contents of pianotech digest..." >> >> >> Today's Topics: >> >> 1. Re: DC under block was Re: tuning pin tightness (David Love) >> >> >> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- >> >> Message: 1 >> Date: Mon, 1 Feb 2010 06:41:55 -0800 >> From: "David Love" <davidlovepianos at comcast.net> >> To: <pianotech at ptg.org> >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] DC under block was Re: tuning pin >> tightness >> Message-ID: <000301caa34c$b386d340$1a9479c0$@net> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8" >> >> THE DC does normally belong under the soundboard. I think what Wim >> describes are unusual circumstances where other measures are necessary. A >> 15 watt DC connected to a humidistat and attached to the action stack can >> help in very high humidity conditions where repining may not be the best >> solution and lubrication is ineffective. It?s not standard but can help. >> After acclimation of such an installation be prepared to tighten action >> screws. In this case, we were talking about a possible solution or >> temporary measure to address an overly tight pinblock. It may or may not >> work anyway. >> >> >> >> David Love >> >> www.davidlovepianos.com >> >> >> >> From: pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On >> Behalf Of Piano Boutique >> Sent: Monday, February 01, 2010 6:33 AM >> To: pianotech at ptg.org >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] DC under block was Re: tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> I believe that a DC belongs under the soundboard. If it is under the pin >> block it dries out the block and makes the action too loose. If the action >> needs lubing or pinning, that is the way it is, but I have seen a lot of >> clattery actions and I have followed it to the DC being placed at or under >> the action. >> >> >> >> William >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> ----- Original Message ----- >> >> From: wimblees at aol.com >> >> To: pianotech at ptg.org >> >> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 7:49 PM >> >> Subject: [pianotech] DC under block was Re: tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> For what it's worth, when I first got to Hawaii, I saw a lot of DC under >> the pin block, and I moved them under the piano, where I thought they were >> supposed to be. But then the other tuners told me that putting them under >> the piano doesn't do any good, but they are needed in the action cavity. We >> put DC's under the pin blocks because there is enough humidity in the air, >> and it never gets cold, so the air, and subsequently the pin block, never >> dries out. What the DC does do is help keep the moisture out of the action, >> and thus keeps the centers free. I have noticed, however, that a lot of >> grands without a DC in the action cavity, do have sticking centers. >> >> Willem (Wim) Blees, RPT >> Piano Tuner/Technician >> >> 94-505 Kealakaa Str. >> >> Mililani, Oahu, HI 96789 >> 808-349-2943 >> >> <http://www.bleespiano.com/> >www.Bleespiano.com<http://www.bleespiano.com/> >> Author of: >> The Business of Piano Tuning >> available from Potter Press >> www.pianotuning.com >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: William Truitt <surfdog at metrocast.net> >> To: pianotech at ptg.org >> Sent: Sun, Jan 31, 2010 1:37 pm >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> Hi David: >> >> >> >> I agree with you that the 15 watt damp chaser bar under the block is >> unlikely to destroy it, and would perhaps to some degree loosen the pins in >> a desirable fashion. How much and whether that would be enough is another >> question. My point was that such use would not necessarily be viewed >> favorably by a manufacturer. I recall a few years ago I had installed a d. >> c. unit in a Steinway in a church that had significant and tuning >> destabilizing issues due to excessive humidity and then dryness. It quieted >> the pitch movement down as expected. Some time later in an unrelated >> matter, the church music director had a conversation with the area Steinway >> dealer, who advised her to remove it because it would damage the piano, and >> told her that it was Steinway?s position that these units did more harm than >> good if improperly installed. Therefore, they advised against the use of >> them. I thought that was idiotic, but that seemed to be their official >> position. >> >> >> >> I agree with you on more radical (actually more sensible) solutions if not >> under warranty. Les will have a selling job to the manufacturer , to be >> sure. Still the effort should be made; nothing ventured, nothing gained. >> He needs to charge appropriately for his time ASAP, for sure. Or decline >> to work on the piano in the future. >> >> >> >> Will >> >> >> >> From: <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org> pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [ >> <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org?> mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On >> Behalf Of David Love >> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 4:45 PM >> To: <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> pianotech at ptg.org >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> No respect needed I was being somewhat facetious which is why I introduced >> it as ?if you?re brave?. I figured people would get it but evidently not. >> If the manufacturer considers tight pins a warranty issue then send it back >> but good luck with that. Otherwise it?s the customer?s problem and the >> tech?s job to help them find the best solution or just live with a difficult >> piano to tune. If the block is truly not tunable and if it?s not under >> warranty then I don?t see the problem with more radical solutions. I can?t >> imagine a 15 watt bar under a delignit block destroying it under any >> circumstances and might be worth a try in the short term until a more >> thorough approach is considered, like restringing or removing pins, reaming >> and driving them back in. Or, you could just pawn the job off on your least >> favorite tech in the area (that?s a joke too, btw). >> >> >> >> David Love >> >> <http://www.davidlovepianos.com/> www.davidlovepianos.com >> >> >> >> From: <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org> pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [ >> <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org?> mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On >> Behalf Of William Truitt >> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 12:06 AM >> To: <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> pianotech at ptg.org >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> With all due respect, David, I think that?s a bit of a dangerous >> recommendation. I understand why you are recommending it from the point of >> view of shrinking the wood by drying it and therefore expanding the holes to >> make the pins looser. But the dealer and manufacturer might look askance at >> this, saying it ruined the block, thus making it Les?s problem, even a >> potential lawsuit ? in other words, an out for them and bigger trouble for >> Les. And the repinning, without the manufacturers blessing and approval as >> a solution to a warranty problem; could otherwise void the warranty to the >> piano?s owners. >> >> >> >> It?s up to the manufacturer to decide how to approach this as a warranty >> service problem. That begins usually by having the dealer?s technician come >> out to appraise the situation, advise the manufacturer?s tech rep, and then >> follow through with a solution. That solution might be having the dealer?s >> technician come out to perform a warranty repair such as repining, or >> sending the piano back to the factory for repair, or replacing the piano >> with a new one. All this, of course, is dependent on the dealer and >> manufacturer?s willingness to follow through. >> >> >> >> If the dealer is distant or recalcitrant, sometimes an independent >> technician can contact the manufacturer directly and work out the solution >> path. I?ve done that a number of times before, as have many others. It has >> been my experience that, once you establish to the tech rep that you are not >> a blithering idiot and actually know what you are talking about, that they >> will work with you towards a meaningful solution that addresses the problem >> and takes care of the customer. >> >> >> >> >> >> But back to my question- doesn?t >> >> > the company selling the instrument have responsibility for a number of >> >> >years? >> >> >> >> Ask them. We don't make the call. >> >> >> >> Ron is right. Ask them. That?s where it all begins. Nobody who has >> responsibility here, the manufacturer and the dealer as their >> representative, can begin to address the problem and seek a solution until >> they know about it. Often they will want your experiences in writing. >> Strictly speaking the company selling the instrument does not any warranty >> responsibilities as guarantor, they serve only as an authorized intermediary >> as part of their dealer agreement. >> >> >> >> Les needs the church?s blessing (sorry, I couldn?t resist the pun) to act >> as their agent in dealing with the dealer or maker. If the church does not >> want to bother, then that?s their call. But if that were to be the case, >> then he should be charging appropriately for that 4 hour tuning. Usually >> that gets people?s attention when the cost is twice as much every time. >> >> >> >> Will Truitt >> >> >> >> >> >> >> >> From: <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org> pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [ >> <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org?> mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On >> Behalf Of David Love >> Sent: Sunday, January 31, 2010 1:35 AM >> To: <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> pianotech at ptg.org >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> If you feel brave you might try sticking a dampp-chaser rod right under the >> block and see if that doesn?t open it up a bit. >> >> >> >> David Love >> >> <http://www.davidlovepianos.com/> www.davidlovepianos.com >> >> >> >> From: <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org> pianotech-bounces at ptg.org [ >> <mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org?> mailto:pianotech-bounces at ptg.org] On >> Behalf Of <mailto:wimblees at aol.com> wimblees at aol.com >> Sent: Saturday, January 30, 2010 7:54 PM >> To: <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> pianotech at ptg.org >> Subject: Re: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> >> >> Les >> >> >> >> I doubt if the church will spend the money to repin, much less restring. >> Tell the minister of music that the pianos are untunable, and tell him to >> have the dealer send out his tuner to solve the problem. >> >> >> >> Wim >> >> >> >> >> >> -----Original Message----- >> From: Leslie Bartlett < <mailto:l-bartlett at sbcglobal.net> >> l-bartlett at sbcglobal.net> >> To: <mailto:pianotech at ptg.org> pianotech at ptg.org >> Sent: Sat, Jan 30, 2010 2:39 pm >> Subject: [pianotech] tuning pin tightness >> >> A local church bought three pianos, roughly topping out at $200,000. Two >> are Estonias. On one the pins are so tight they pop, most of the quite >> loudly making it un-tunable for all practical purposes. These are about one >> year old. What would you recommend as far as some action regarding the >> piano? I?m afraid of twisting pins to breaking point. >> >> thanks >> >> les bartlett >> >> -------------- next part -------------- >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed... >> URL: < >> >http://ptg.org/pipermail/pianotech.php/attachments/20100201/de363801/attachment.ht >m >> > >> >> ------------------------------ >> >> _______________________________________________ >> pianotech mailing list >> pianotech at ptg.org >> http://ptg.org/mailman/listinfo/pianotech >> >> >> End of pianotech Digest, Vol 16, Issue 2 >> **************************************** >>
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