<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; = charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2719.2200" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Listening here with the same questions<O:)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>and wanting answers.</FONT></DIV> <DIV>Joe Goss<BR><A href="mailto:imatunr@srvinet.com">imatunr@srvinet.com</A><BR><A href="http://www.mothergoosetools.com">www.mothergoosetools.com</A></DI= V> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B> <A title=mathstar@salemnet.com = href="mailto:mathstar@salemnet.com">Alan R. Barnard</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Sunday, September 22, = 2002 6:14 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Learning Aural = Tuning</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This is addressed to all the truly = skilled aural tuners out there. I hope I can word this so it makes sense. It's been = a real "stopper" for me in trusting my aural tuning.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I can set A440. I can set a good 4:2 A37</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I can fit D42 and E44 in that octave = pretty well (match the ETD I check with)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Jim Coleman Sr., Randy = Potter, Geo. Defebaugh, and others are pretty persuasive for using the faster = beating intervals (3rds and 6ths) to set temperament.</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>They all say "Tune F33 from A37 about = 7 bps flat ... " and they take off from there.</FONT> <FONT = face=Arial size=2>I like and use Randy's pivot tone thirds, i.e., after = tuning F45, tune C#41 to get an even progression of F33-A37-C#41-F45-A49. Theory is, if you can get a good progression, you have good A-A and F-F octaves and a good = relationship between those two octaves, i.e., the F33-A37 third.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>All of these descriptions of = temperament setting use, and I am quoting, terms like "about 7 bps," "close = approximations," "actual beats will vary from one piano to another," etc.  = Vague as He**...</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This is also a quote "While tuning we = constantly compare one interval to another, listening for the sense of the beats, = the feel of the beat speed."</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I have no problem with any of that = and I understand and can actually do it all. BUT ...</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>HERE THE QUESTION (Looks like several = questions, but really asking the same thing each time ...)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>How do you really know that your A-A = is <EM>ideal</EM>? That it isn't a smidge two narrow or wide for the inharmonicity of that particular instrument? That you have even <EM>started</EM> the temperament "correctly" for that piano? How do = you KNOW that your F33-A37 is <EM>ideal</EM> for that particular instrument?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This talk about Franz Mohr, etc., = highlights the point: A lot of you folks can--in your sleep--set a really sweet = temperament on any decent piano you face, Yet the starting intervals seem = arbitrarily set, to me! "About 7 bps ..." </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>So what the heck does "about" = mean?  Do you have to set the whole T. before you "know"? </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>(Is this making sense?) I'm not = talking about getting just a <EM>useful</EM> temperament, as I believe the "about" = thing will do that every time. I am talking about getting a really = <EM>good</EM> temperament for each piano.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>'Preciate some comments.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Alan Barnard</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Listening in Salem</FONT></DIV> <DIV> </DIV></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>