<HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=windows-1250"> <STYLE></STYLE> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2912" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY id=MailContainerBody style="PADDING-LEFT: 10px; FONT-WEIGHT: normal; FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #000000; BORDER-TOP-STYLE: none; PADDING-TOP: 15px; FONT-STYLE: normal; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma; BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: none; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none; TEXT-DECORATION: none; BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none" bgColor=#d8d0c8 leftMargin=0 topMargin=0 name="Compose message area" CanvasTabStop="true" acc_role="text"> <P>RPT "status" is slowly but surely going to improve.  PTG hasn't been around that long, you know...</P> <P>I think it is interesting to read Les' comments about the testing process..."it isn't perfect", "I got in trouble even fighting over tests", "but the burearucrats had their way and I finally jumped through their hoops"...Les, who do you think made the test?   Technicians like you and me.   If you think it could be perfect...by all means send in your ideas...get involved in the testing committees...if you think the RPT test was just kind of thrown together...you are very wrong...Who are these burearucrats?   Technicians like you and me...volunteering their services...I doubt if a single one of those technicians would consider themselves bureaurucrats...kind of insulting, to me...maybe you could explain the fighting over the tests?   Imagine if everyone taking the test wanted to change some part of the test to his liking...chaos...</P> <P>So Les, you didn't learn anything from taking the test?  The practice before taking the test?  No feeling of accomplishment when you passed?  </P> <P>Are you now volunteering for PTG?   Helping to administer the test?  <BR><BR>David Ilvedson, RPT<BR>Pacifica, CA 94044<BR><BR><BR></P> <DIV style="PADDING-RIGHT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 3px solid; PADDING-TOP: 5px"> <HR> Original message<BR>From: "Leslie Bartlett" <L-BARTLETT@SBCGLOBAL.NET><BR>To: "Cy Shuster" <CY@SHUSTERPIANO.COM>, "Pianotech List" <PIANOTECH@PTG.ORG><BR>Received: 7/29/2006 7:19:44 AM<BR>Subject: RE: Why? Why? Why?<BR><BR> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=295435313-29072006><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>I was a member who never planned on taking the exams.  As such I never expeted RPT status to be of any particular value, and after being RPT for nearly 10 years, I still sort of feel that way.    My confidence has always come as I have done good work.  I have only a very few times gained work because I was an RPT.     But the ideals of the PTG suggest that this is an organization designed to support technicians of a certain level of accomplishment or above, and in order to verify that, persons have to somehow demonstrate their competence in a public forum.  The method isn't perfect,and I got in trouble even fighting over the tests, but the bureaucrats had their way and I finally jumped through their hoops.    However until one has done things <EM>their</EM> way, one has not proven satisfactorily that s/he has the modicum of accomplishment to be recognized as one of those creatures called RPT, and therefore really does not merit the same advertised credibility as one who has gone through the hoops.    We have a local guy, his dad a CTE in another state, who refuses to join the Guild because of some bad experiences he had in this chapter a couiple decades ago.  I'll put his tunings and rebuilds up against most anyone, certainly around Houston, at least.   Unless one knows him and of his work, one really has no way of knowing whether he can "cut it" or is bogus.      I hate bureaucracies, and PTG is one of them things.    But within it are a lot of very good people who have come to a mind to join as a Guild, to provide meetings and training conventions, email lists etc. to anyone,  but with their stated goal is that persons disipline themselves to pass certain tests which qualifiy them as RPT. So, <EM>implied in membership</EM> is going through the exam process.  I certainly hate to admit it as I fought it for several years.   I have to side with the RPT's, though.  I know lots of people who are incredibly smart who are not college graduates.  Until they have jumped through all the college hoops, they cannot claim the same status in the work place as a college graduate, except for those few who excel so far that their accomplishments far outdistance a piece of paper.  Same with RPT status.    It's certainly an imperfect system.  I am quite sure devising a perfect system would only work for perfect persons, and so few of those exist as to make the exercise rather futile.   So, in a sense persons who are not RPT's are non-existent as they have not completed their memebership by doing what is at least implicit in the bylaws- gain skills to pass exams and prove they have the skills to call themselves RPT.    In <EM>my</EM> defense as RPT,  I jumped through the hoops and am not unhappy that I do have a greater status in the organization than one who has not. The exams are not particularly difficult. For me they were psychological torture. For others they are just a slight bump in the road.  But those who are RPT have put their skills on display in public, to be judged by people of competence.</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=295435313-29072006><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>JMO</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=295435313-29072006><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>les bartlett</FONT></SPAN></DIV> <DIV dir=ltr align=left><SPAN class=295435313-29072006><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Houston</FONT></SPAN></DIV><BR> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left> <HR tabIndex=-1> <FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Cy Shuster<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, July 29, 2006 8:18 AM<BR><B>To:</B> Pianotech List; James H Frazee<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Why? Why? Why?<BR></FONT><BR></DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Verdana Ref" size=2>Only RPTs are listed to the public.  If you login to the member area, you are listed.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Verdana Ref" size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Verdana Ref" size=2>--Cy--</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face="Verdana Ref" size=2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=jimfrazee@msn.com href="mailto:jimfrazee@msn.com">James H Frazee</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=ptg@ptg.org href="mailto:ptg@ptg.org">ptg@ptg.org</A> ; <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Piano_tech_list</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, July 29, 2006 6:41 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Why? Why? Why?</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV>I'd like to know why I am <STRONG><EM>non-existent</EM></STRONG> in your database of members when using "Finding a Technician" - I'm in my second year of membership so don't even think about telling me the site hasn't been updated - you certainly send my dues bill on time!  I am extremely unhappy about this!  I've also searched for a couple of other techs I know in my chapter - same result!  Why am I paying dues to you?  To do "part" of your job?  Unacceptable, period.  Shame on you.</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV>Jim Frazee<BR>914.763.8689<BR><A title=mailto:jimfrazee@msn.com href="mailto:jimfrazee@msn.com">jimfrazee@msn.com</A></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P><FONT size=2>--<BR>No virus found in this incoming message.<BR>Checked by AVG Free Edition.<BR>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.4/402 - Release Date: 07/27/2006<BR></FONT></P><BR> <P><FONT size=2>--<BR>No virus found in this outgoing message.<BR>Checked by AVG Free Edition.<BR>Version: 7.1.394 / Virus Database: 268.10.5/403 - Release Date: 07/28/2006<BR></FONT></P></DIV></BODY></HTML>