<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2963" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>can I suggest the word "approximately" as an answers to your question ? :-D</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Since I'm a newbie, I'm probably not yet as selective in the result as any of you </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I wonder if, from an ethic point of view, we can call "savage beast" a birdcage upright (because of the cage) ;-)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now, I don't feel it is as bad as you describe. I don't know if there are various qualities of wooden frame, but I just started by giving a quarter of turn on each string, one row of at a time, an then started tuning...</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now that's true, it moves quite quickly. thats precisely why I decided to learn tuning :-)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Philippe Errembault</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=alan@forsythalan.wanadoo.co.uk href="mailto:alan@forsythalan.wanadoo.co.uk">alan forsyth</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, August 18, 2006 7:42 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Is it a good idea to tuned on itself a piano outtuned becuseofhumidity</DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT><BR></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>I'm curious as to how you go about pitch raising a wooden frame piano? I've done several before and each time it makes a mockery of my sensibilities. They do not follow the normal rules of pitch changes. Some of them you can tune in 5 passes and at the end of all that , A49 ends up at the same pitch that you started out with. I have about 25 of these savage beasts on my records. Some of them are as follows;</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hartman 1860</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Collard & Collard 1860</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Erard 1847</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>B Squire 1859</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>A Bord 1891</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>John Broadwood 1893</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Erard 1830</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Challen 1885</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>James MacBeth 1870</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Murdoch McKillop 1885</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hopkinson s/n 12 1835</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>B Squire 1870</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Challen & Hodgson 1875</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>John Broadwood 1869</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>William Ross  1860</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>Henry Ward 1861</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>What is interesting is that some were still being produced way after the invention of the full iron frame. I know that in previous centuries, nuns in the Convents were taught to tune their own pianos mainly because these old wooden framed efforts (the pianos, not the nuns) needed tuning every day.</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT></STRONG> </DIV> <DIV><STRONG><FONT face=Arial size=2>AF</FONT></STRONG></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=phil.errembault@skynet.be href="mailto:phil.errembault@skynet.be">Philippe Errembault</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 17, 2006 11:57 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Is it a good idea to tuned on itself a piano outtuned becuse ofhumidity</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Well, because I use it !!!</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>but with the wooden frame, it moves quite much with humidity variations. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>the point is the Damp-chaser is probably much more expensive than the value of the piano...</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Now, if I ever have to change the piano, maybe I could move the damp-chaser to the new one !?!</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Philippe Errembault</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=collin.s@skynet.be href="mailto:collin.s@skynet.be">Stéphane Collin</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 17, 2006 2:37 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Is it a good idea to tuned on itself a pianoouttunedbecuseofhumidity</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi Philippe.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>If the piano is not worth preserving it, why would you preserve it ?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Stéphane Collin.</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=phil.errembault@skynet.be href="mailto:phil.errembault@skynet.be">Philippe Errembault</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 17, 2006 7:32 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Is it a good idea to tuned on itself a piano outtunedbecuseofhumidity</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I thought about this, don't you think this is quite expensive in regard of the value of the piano ?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Philippe Errembault</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=collin.s@skynet.be href="mailto:collin.s@skynet.be">Stéphane Collin</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, August 17, 2006 12:05 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Is it a good idea to tuned on itself a piano outtuned becuseofhumidity</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Buy a Damp-chaser (is is two m or two p or two hyphens ?)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Stéphane Collin.</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> </BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>