<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PersonName"/>  <style>  </style>  </head> <body bgcolor=white lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue> <div class=Section1> If you bought a new car and the paint started peeling off a fender you would not get a new car, even though it is impossible to get a factory perfect finish anywhere but the factory. You would get a fender repainted. That is the way warranties work.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> This does not sound like a “severe” problem to me at all. It sounds like an extremely solvable problem that any tech worth his salt can fix. The holes are a little big. Put some oversize pins in. The piano will function as normal for decades, yea even a century or more. There is no downside to the customer, mfr and dealer expenses are reduced (keeping prices lower for everyone) and the tech makes a little money on warranty work. It’s all good.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> If the oversize pins are still loose (indicating some kind of crack) then we may have a severe problem. But in my limited experience I have never seen such a thing on a new piano made in the last 30 years. <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> If a piano cannot be fixed to function, that is when you look to do exchanges. <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Reading the responses would lead me to believe that nobody does warranty work on new pianos. <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Dean<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> </div> From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of Robin Blankenship Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2006 1:45 PM To: <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Pianotech List</st1:PersonName> Subject: Re: this property is condemned...what would you have done?<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> Avery,<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Ditto. I worked for a couple of years for a very well known and large east coast piano retail chain and saw them have to "eat" several brand new grands of various makes simply because there was a gross tech problem up front with the piano. In one or two cases, that retail company stopped carrying certain brands because of that very thing. A piano IS or IS NOT of an acceptable level of quality and consistency coming out of the factory. If not, then it is the manufacturer's problem. This particular problem sounds like a very severe one. Work-arounds at this level of issue and at this stage of the piano's life are just not a smart way to proceed. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> IMTCWOHM (In my two cents' worth of humble opinion)<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Robin Blankenship<o:p></o:p> </div> <blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt; margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'> <div> ----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p> </div> <div style='font-color:black'> From: <a href="mailto:avery1@houston.rr.com" title="avery1@houston.rr.com">Avery</a> <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> To: <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org" title="pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</a> <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2006 1:15 PM<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Subject: RE: this property is condemned...what would you have done?<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> William, As far as I'm concerned, that isn't the point! The point is that a 3 month old piano has loose tuning pins. Whatever the reason! And in that case, the manufacturer should replace it! I'm personally not going to "cover anyones ass" here! It's their fault and they should have to deal with it/accept the loss/whatever! Just my opinion! Avery At 10:16 AM 9/21/2006, you wrote: <o:p></o:p> Having worked in that position, any piano you can save will save you a store contract and a supplier pat on the back.  No one makes money if the piano has to go back.    William         PIANO BOUTIQUE William Benjamin Piano Tuner Extraordinaire <a href="http://www.pianoboutique.biz">www.pianoboutique.biz</a> The tuner alone, preserves the tone.  <o:p></o:p> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center> </div> From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [<a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org" eudora=autourl> mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a>] On Behalf Of <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Dean May</st1:PersonName> Sent: Thursday, September 21, 2006 12:11 AM To: '<st1:PersonName w:st="on">Pianotech List</st1:PersonName>' Subject: RE: this property is condemned...what would you have done?   I doubt there are structural problems. Probably the drill bit got dull on the bottom row and made the holes a little larger. It can probably be fixed just fine with oversize pins on the ones that are loose.   Pianos with extremely hard pin blocks have very little tolerance for variation in hole size or variation in pin size. If the hole gets a little large or the pin a little small on the tolerance side the pin will be loose. It does not mean there is a structural problem. Given the modern piano designer’s propensity to use too many laminations it is extremely unlikely that there is a structural problem in the pin block.   Talk to the tech support person of the manufacturer. They will probably have an established protocol. The trick will be in what you have already communicated to the customer. If you have already prepped the customer to expect nothing less than a new piano, then that is probably the only thing that will satisfy them. On the other hand if you communicate that the mfr will solve the problem you will probably have netted yourself an easy re-pin job.   Dean  <o:p></o:p> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center> </div> From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [<a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org" eudora=autourl> mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a>] On Behalf Of piannaman@aol.com Sent: Wednesday, September 20, 2006 10:36 PM To: pianotech@ptg.org Subject: this property is condemned...what would you have done?    Just got home from a client's home.  She just purchased a piano around 3 months ago, and I was contracted by the store to do a warranty tuning.  While raising the pitch, I noticed a couple of loose tuning pins...then another, another, another, etc.  All along the bottom row of pins.    I called the owner of the store--a good friend of mine, btw--and told him that the piano should be returned to the factory in exchange for a sound instrument, as it is structurally unsound, and that any repair done to it would be unsuitable to undertake in the customer's home.   What thinketh y'all?     <o:p></o:p> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center> </div> <a href="http://pr.atwola.com/promoclk/1615326657x4311227241x4298082137/aol?redir=http%3A%2F%2Fwww%2Eaol%2Ecom%2Fnewaol">Check out the new AOL</a>. 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