<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40" xmlns:v = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1 = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"><HEAD><TITLE>Light fixtures</TITLE> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE>v\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } o\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } w\:* { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } .shape { BEHAVIOR: url(#default#VML) } </STYLE> <o:SmartTagType name="City" namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"></o:SmartTagType><o:SmartTagType name="place" namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"></o:SmartTagType> <STYLE> st1\:*{behavior:url(#default#ieooui) } </STYLE> <STYLE>  </STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY lang=EN-US id=role_body style="BORDER-TOP-STYLE: none; BORDER-RIGHT-STYLE: none; BORDER-LEFT-STYLE: none; BORDER-BOTTOM-STYLE: none" bottomMargin=7 vLink=blue link=blue bgColor=#ffffff leftMargin=7 topMargin=7 rightMargin=7> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=ilvey@sbcglobal.net href="mailto:ilvey@sbcglobal.net">David Ilvedson</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Tuesday, December 05, 2006 11:10 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: Problems with new Steinways</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV>With the correct tool...new deadleader, that repair would be quickly done...don't you think?   1/2 hour tops?   To me, it seems seems like something that can happen in a piano.   Wood changes...the customer has to educated on this sort of thing.   I don't see this as a Steinway warranty problem...imho<BR><BR>David Ilvedson, RPT<BR>Pacifica, CA 94044<BR><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>David,</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Respectfully I do not agree with some of your post. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    First, diagnose, remove stack, swedge EVERY key lead . Same with most of the damper leads. Stack back on and reinstall? All in a half hour?</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I don't care what tool is available the job is not completed in a half hour and I move fast.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Yes I do agree that this is something that can happen in a piano. Curious that the 100 year old Steinway upright next to the B (also with climate control) did nor suffer from loose leads .</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>     The customer WAS educated as to climate control and due to professional background has a better understanding than most of us as to the nature of materials and their reaction to environmental conditions.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I do agree with you that this was not a warranty issue. The contract clearly states a five year limit and this piano was six years old.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    My point in this saga was not to bash Steinway or to disparage the staff. Kent and Eric are both individuals for whom I have the highest regard.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    BUT ! In this case in my opinion some flexibility and support could and should have been extended .</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>     My fee's to manufacturers are always modest--Usually I ask them to tell me the number. <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Less than two hundred dollars would have bought more than that in good will .</FONT></DIV></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I had a recent experience with Charles Walter where Kevin compensated me as an independent tech to correct some problems with a new Walter vertical that were clearly dealer prep related. My customer was very impressed with the company for correcting the problem (Regulation related) and will be sending a letter of thanks to the management .</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    The scenario with the Steinway issue was the exact opposite.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>   </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>     $50,000 spent should in my opinion buy some latitude in the interest of the customer.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    This is not an attack on soundbard design, back scale issues etc. It is Steinway's choice and right to design their products as they see fit. I'm not a designer or rebuilder, but information gathered from this list and from classes offered by those who are ,combined with 30 years in the field have helped me form opinions and beliefs as to the merits and design of grand piano's.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I don't expect Steinway's methods will or even should change because Tom Driscoll  read that there are alternatives to their design principals but along with this recent experience as described  my recommendations to those who request them are so influenced.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>   </FONT><FONT face=Arial size=2>    My opinion.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Tom Driscoll RPT</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT><BR></DIV> <DIV style="PADDING-RIGHT: 5px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 3px solid; PADDING-TOP: 5px"> <HR> Original message<BR>From: "Tom Driscoll" <TOMTUNER@VERIZON.NET><BR>To: "Pianotech List" <PIANOTECH@PTG.ORG><BR>Received: 12/3/2006 8:38:52 AM<BR>Subject: Re: Problems with new Steinways<BR><BR> <DIV align=left><FONT face=Arial size=2>Dale,</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Example of the Steinway warranty:</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    6 year old B  in a private home.Serviced regularly (By me) here in New England with climate control system. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Action setup was good and visiting pianists are complimentary of the piano.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Now here's the rub. During regular service I hear a rattle. Not hard to find as it's a loose key weight. I pull the stack and all but a few are loose. While I'm at it I check the damper levers and guess what ? </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I'm preparing the piano for a recital and  it's after business hours so I can't contact the factory for warranty information.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    My client(s) are good friends of mine and have a well equipted home shop.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    We set up a methodology and with some improvisation found an appropriate punch and worked together to swedge every lead tight (300 leads?)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    The damper leads were tightened with a modified plier tool in my kit similar to ones seen advertised in the journal. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    So a few hours later I start tuning.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Now , next business day I call tech services at N.Y. and to my regret I'm informed the warr. is only five years on Steinway AND the problem was humidity related and would not have been covered anyway. When I mentioned that the piano has a climate control system the gentleman said it was probably disabled for a while(It was not!) and that could cause loose leads. </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I mention that thousands of pianos in my service from as far back as the late 1800's have been in New England without climate control and have key leads</FONT> <FONT face=Arial size=2>as tight as the day installed but did not get much response other than the Warranty had expired anyway.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    To my mind when someone pays $50,000 for a piano a bit more support should come from the manufacturer.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I wouldn't have been looking to break the bank with a bill . Perhaps the Representative 's hands were tied.(by the way it was someone other than Kent ) I have had other manufacturers --Yamaha for example ---extend the Warranty on a minor problem such as this.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    "I'm sorry your client is having a problem with our piano. In the interest of good customer-technician relations what would you charge us to fix the problem ?</FONT> <FONT face=Arial size=2>"</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    The answer would have been $150.00.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    My clients paid me that night with a generous gratuity but it would have nice to get some reimbursement for them.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    While I'm on a roll why is every problem presented to Steinway the first time they've heard of this and someone else's fault (Frozen action centers as example).</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>   End of rant.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Tom Driscoll RPT</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>   </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> </BLOCKQUOTE><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>