<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40" xmlns:o = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1 = "urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1"><o:SmartTagType name="State" namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"></o:SmartTagType><o:SmartTagType name="City" namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"></o:SmartTagType><o:SmartTagType name="place" namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags"></o:SmartTagType> <STYLE>  </STYLE> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2900.2995" name=GENERATOR></HEAD> <BODY lang=EN-US vLink=purple link=blue bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Hi, Michelle:</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Whatever technique you use, you need to understand what is happening while you're turning the pins.  Some torque is always being forced into the pin while you turn it, and that torque needs to be removed before you go on to the next pin.   I'll bet you have left too much torque in the pin, and this is causing the tension to increase in that front segment.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I think you have found a way to remove that excess torque, and that is to go down past the "spot where it needs to be".  You want the string to be at pitch, all the various segments at equal tension.  If the string tends to "climb" to the upside, you still have to turn that pin counterclockwise until it doesn't.  Sometimes you may have to actually make your last little hammer movement to the upside, after you went below.  Do whatever works for you.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I found that if I "pound" the string too much while trying to settle the pin, the string tends to climb in pitch later.  Therefore I don't pound much anymore.  </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Some pianos have more friction on the bearing points, while some have less.  Some have tight pins, some have loose pins.  Each situation, and combination of these, will need a different technique.  Some  pianos have bearing bars which are coated with laquer or other anti-corrosive substance which increases the friction.  I find this on a lot of Chinese pianos, and I sometimes use Protek to help the string render across these friction points.  I don't service a lot of Yamahas, so I can't  speak to your experience.  I generally find Yamahas to be tuner-friendly, for the ones I occasionally tune.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Sometimes new tuners tend to pull the string too far on the sharp side before putting it back down.  Try to pull the string just a little above, but not very much at all.  If the pin is tight, it's easy to pull it too far sharp before the pin actually moves.  That makes it hard to tune because you have to put it too far flat to make it move back down.  That may be part of your problem.  Some pianos are just hard to tune, period.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    You need to control your hammer with very tiny movements, and be sure that the pin actually moves in the block.  It takes time to learn to do this, so don't be discouraged.  Also, you will find that keeping the tuning hammer shaft parallel to the string helps minimizing "flagpoling" or bending of the pin.  Some tuners point the shaft/handle towards you, over the stretcher (grands), and others (like me) point it away.  On verticals, that would be pointing your hammer straight up, 12:00 position.  That way you won't bend the pin and affect the tuning.  Of course, the pin is going to bend, regardless, but you want it to bend left or right only.  Bending forward or backward, the pin is going to raise or lower the pitch.  It is especially effective to have the hammer parallel where there is less friction on the bearing points (like agraffes).  I often use a 45 degree angle in the capo area, because there's more friction there, and it works to my advantage.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Basically, what I'm trying to say is, you will have to find your individual technique for each situation.  If you find that special way that works for you, use it.  Put it in your bag of tricks.  I know what works for me, and maybe it will help.  I know what  I'm trying to achieve.  I want the string to resist the tendency to go flat when I give a hard blow, but I don't want it to climb sharp either.  Somehow I try to get the pin to have a little "reverse torque" so it holds the string where I want it.  It's something I've worked out over many years.  I use a little torque to insure the string isn't going to go flat.  I might even tap the end of the lever downwards (grands) momentarily so it bends ever so slightly like a spring to hold the string in tune, to set the pin.  I never "bend" the pin so much that it stays bent permanently.  It would be that last bit of finesse needed to lock in that unison, not a technique that I would use unless I was REAL close already.  Over the years, I've found this to be effective in achieving stability in my tunings.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    I hope this helps.  Best of luck.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    Paul McCloud</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>    San Diego</FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B> <A title=michelle@cdaustin.com href="mailto:michelle@cdaustin.com">Michelle Smith</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">'Pianotech List'</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, December 09, 2006 9:58 PM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Yahama tuning challenges</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV class=Section1> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">I’m probably opening up a huge can of worms, but here goes!  <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">As a newbie tuner, I’m still fascinated by the different tuning personalities of certain brands of pianos.  My current frustration is with Yamaha pianos, uprights and grands.  Techniques I use for other pianos just don’t seem to work here.  When tuning Yamahas, I do the typical approach from above, carefully “notch tuning” until I get down to the correct pitch.  Then I let go and the darn thing goes sharp.  I end up doing a little jig where I approach from above, go past the spot where it needs to be, and then back up again at which point it usually settles in nicely.  Does this make any sense at all?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">The fact that the pitch goes back up when I let go of the hammer makes me think that I am not settling the bottom of the pin properly.  I’m worried that my “jig” technique described above it not going to produce a stable tuning.  Any advice or experiences on this particular brand?<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">PS – I was just looking in the Different Strokes book by Ken Burton and the closest comparison I can find is The Snake on page 59.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">By the way, my incoming server is down right now so if you try to respond privately, it may bounce.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: " ITC?;color:blue? Sans Tempus>Michelle Smith<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: " ITC?;color:blue? Sans Tempus>Smith Piano Service<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoAutoSig><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: " ITC?;color:blue? Sans Tempus>Bastrop</SPAN></FONT></st1:City><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: " Sans Tempus color:blue? ITC?;>, <st1:State w:st="on">Texas</st1:State></SPAN></FONT></st1:place><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: " Sans Tempus color:blue? ITC?;><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: " ITC?;color:blue? Sans Tempus>(512) 466-0238<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoAutoSig><FONT face="Tempus Sans ITC" color=blue size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; FONT-FAMILY: " ITC?;color:blue? Sans Tempus>michelle@cdaustin.com<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P> <P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>