<!doctype html public "-//W3C//DTD W3 HTML//EN"> <html><head><style type="text/css"></style><title>Re: A tenor bridge conversion</title></head><body> <div>Hi Stéphane,</div> <div><br></div> <div>Its an interesting question you raise. I often wonder why they've suffered it for so long also. I would have ditched it in an instant, but I don't work in a hierarchical structure, and I don't have a history to respect. I suspect that a lot of the problem for a major factory with an illustrious past is that were they to make major changes to the design, people would automatically ask what was wrong with the previous design? While ever you change nothing, you don't have to admit that anything is wrong, even if it doesn't work.</div> <div><br></div> <div>I can just imagine what a warm and fuzzy reception one might get at the Bechstein factory if one of the troops went up to Mr Shulz and complained about some aspect of the design. In 2005 when we exhibited our action on the Gold Coast, Carl Shulz attended the show. He called by the booth where our action was being demonstrated and had a look at the Overs action model. He took a very brief look at it, threw his eyes skywards as if to imply, ". . . what an idiot", and walked on. Yes, I can just imagine how new thinking would be 'eagerly' encouraged at the Bechstein camp.</div> <div><br></div> <div>I also believe that for many companies there are almost traditional points at which the bass treble sections cross. For example, in the S&S B the holy grail cross point is E20/F21. This scale is, compared to the Bechstein C, a better result, since the B's F21 length is around 147 cm (on the model C the low break note for the treble was 135.2 cm at note E20). But it still doesn't work when compared to the option of taking the break to a higher point.</div> <div><br></div> <div>When pulling S&S Bs down for a rebuild, just to have a listen I've pulled F21 up to Bfl26. The tone is very much superior, and the break percentage is still only at 42%. Of course 42% is getting moderately high for the tri-chords, because we'd need to take the bi-chord covers on the high end of the bass bridge up to around 54% to balance the Z, but even that's doable.</div> <div><br></div> <div>I believe the reason that the B breaks at F21 is because that is where the D breaks. It doesn't work from a musical and tuning stability perspective, but I'll bet that it does from a political standpoint.</div> <div><br></div> <div>Ron O.</div> <div><br></div> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Hi list, hi Ron.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite> </blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Just one stupid question for Ron.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Ron, I truly appreciate your work and effort in piano improvement.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">But reading this, one question comes to my mind :</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">do you really believe that Bechstein engineers were not aware of the % of breaking strength of the tenor strings of their pianos ?  I suppose not.  So the next question is : why the hell those educated people did chose to implement such a design (the tension drop in low trebble bridge) on such an expensive piano ?</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Just wondering.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite> </blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Best regards.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite> </blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><font face="Arial" size="-1">Stéphane Collin.</font></blockquote> <blockquote type="cite" cite><br> <blockquote>----- Original Message -----</blockquote> <blockquote><b>From:</b> <a href="mailto:concertpianoservice@planet.nl">Concert Piano Service</a></blockquote> <blockquote><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</a></blockquote> <blockquote><b>Sent:</b> Monday, January 22, 2007 8:40 PM</blockquote> <blockquote><b>Subject:</b> Re: A tenor bridge conversion</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>On 22-jan-2007, at 1:52, Ron Overs wrote:</blockquote> <blockquote><br> <blockquote type="cite" cite>Hi all,</blockquote> </blockquote> <blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>I've just loaded a couple of images onto my webspace which show the layout for a tenor bridge conversion of a Bechstein model C grand, and an image of the new tenor bridge in place prior to stringing.</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>Here is an image link taken at the layout planning stage;</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><a href="http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/bech_c_tenor1.jpg" >http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/bech_c_tenor1.jpg</a></blockquote > <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>Here is an image link, taken last Friday which shows the finished tenor bridge in place, awaiting strings.</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><a href="http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/bech_c_tenor2.jpg" >http://members.optusnet.com.au/ronovers/bech_c_tenor2.jpg</a></blockquote > <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>The original Bechstein C (circ 1953) was one of the most outstanding examples of a poor scale I've ever measured in a mid sized grand. The tension dropped down to around 18% at note E20 (the lowest note on the long bridge). To rectify this problem, a new tenor bridge was designed from the first original trichord plain note, E20, up to note D#31. The new lowest plain-strung trichord is at a respectable tension of 36%. This will transform the model C from one of the worst crosses in the business, improving it to the point where it is about equivalent to the cross of a model D Steinway (in terms of percentage of tension deviation - the lower the deviation the better the tuning stability). Should have it strung and playing in a couple of weeks.</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>Ron O.</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> </blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>Hi Ron,</blockquote> <blockquote>I have a question :</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>You cut off the treble bridge in the tail. Did you do that because that last part of that treble bridge is so close to the rim?</blockquote> <blockquote>I worked on a brand new Bechstein C and I noticed that those first treble notes (nr 21 to appr. nr 30 sounded weird and were difficult to voice correctly, as usual).</blockquote> <blockquote>I also wonder what kind of string thickness you use on that new bridge you built. Do they get thicker in size because they are shorter?</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>friendly greetings</blockquote> <blockquote>from</blockquote> <blockquote>André Oorebeek</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>Antoni van leeuwenhoekweg 15</blockquote> <blockquote>1401 VW Bussum</blockquote> <blockquote>the Netherlands</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>tel : 0031 35 6975840</blockquote> <blockquote>tel : 0031 652388 008</blockquote> <blockquote><br></blockquote> <blockquote>where music is,</blockquote> <blockquote>no harm can be</blockquote> </blockquote> <div><br></div> <div><br></div> <x-sigsep><pre>-- </pre></x-sigsep> <div><font face="Times New Roman" size="+1" color="#0000FF"><b>OVERS PIANOS - SYDNEY</b></font></div> <div><font color="#000000"><i>   </i></font><font color="#0000FF"><i>Grand Piano Manufacturers</i></font><font color="#000000"><br> _______________________</font></div> <div><font size="-2" color="#000000"><br> </font><font color="#000000">Web http://overspianos.com.au</font></div> <div><font color="#000000">mailto:ron@overspianos.com.au<br> _______________________</font></div> </body> </html>