<html> <body> At 01:23 PM 2/12/2007, you wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">I don´t agree. In my (former) life as aural tuner it took me 1.5 to 2 hours to tune a piano. If a pitch raise has to be done, it takes 2 passes and still takes 1,5 to 2 hours. Of course, the result will be not so fine so that the piano has to be retuned after a few weeks (I talk about heavy PR of 25 cents and more). Of course the retuning is paid again. Now, in my new life as ETD tuner, things changed: I tune nearly every piano in 2 passes. The reason is: the ETD gives absolute pitch, aural tunings do not. If I raise 5 cents, that string becomes lower during tuning. But as aural tuner I react to that, so that the octave may be perfect, but a little bit lower than absolute pitch. The result is a piano which might be 2 cents flat, but that´s the reason why I come back in a few weeks. And: who cares about 2 cents if it´s NOT a concert tuning. When the strategy is to tune every piano twice if pitch is 2 to 5 cents flat, then one should not charge for the 2 passes.</blockquote> Why? <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite=""> And: I always charge an allowance, and here in my hometown every tech does it. I can´t tell the customer: the price depends on how long I tune. If I did so, all the customers would call the other techs with a flat rate.</blockquote> That's not the point. It depends on how stable you want the instrument. Of course, we're probably talking about concert situations here! Avery <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">Gregor <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">From: David Andersen <david@davidandersenpianos.com> Reply-To: Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org> To: Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org> Subject: Re: Paid for Pitch Raises? Date: Mon, 12 Feb 2007 10:12:17 -0800 Daniel---please don't take this personally, brother, but you've  triggered off a rant. What the HELL are you people doing----working without getting paid?  That's insane. You really need to check your approach to life, IMO, if you submit to  this kind of bullshit. Raising the pitch on a piano takes WORK---intense work, between 20  and 40 minutes, if done right. To not get paid for that, or to work  for people who don't intend to pay you for that, is dysfunctional.  Period. What are you thinking about? Would you ever ask any other  kind of service tech to come to your house or business and work for  20-40 minutes FOR FREE? Never. NEVER. Wake up. WAKE UP. You need to start valuing your time, your life, and  your skills. Stand up for yourself, and tell that a**h**le who owns that  store to  sell you a piano for his cost. See what he says. Wake up. Until we demand respect and acknowledgement for our immense knowledge  and skillset we'll be treated like field hands, or dismissable  underlings, or naive idiots, or pathetic losers. There. I feel better now. David Andersen On Feb 11, 2007, at 8:21 PM, daniel carlton wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">The owner of one of the stores explained that they don't want to  have to spend more money than they have to on the used pianos in  particular if they can only sell it for so much. I guess I do see  the logic in that, but what about all the pitch corrections I have  to do on the new pianos? I don't get anything for my time.</blockquote></blockquote> _________________________________________________________________ Don't just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! <a href="http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/" eudora="autourl"> http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/</a> </blockquote></body> </html>