<html><div style='background-color:'><DIV class=RTE> <P>Jurgen,</P> <P>You heard Beethoven played on an 1830's Broadwood that was similar to one Beethoven himself would have played a DECADE OR TWO earlier. You are holding your age really well my friend.</P> <P>Michael<BR><BR></P></DIV> <DIV></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #a0c6e5 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"><FONT style="FONT-SIZE: 11px; FONT-FAMILY: tahoma,sans-serif"> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>pianotech-request@ptg.org</I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>pianotech@ptg.org</I><BR>To:  <I>pianotech@ptg.org</I><BR>Subject:  <I>Pianotech Digest, Vol 1285, Issue 102</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 12:00:24 -0700</I><BR>>Send Pianotech mailing list submissions to<BR>> pianotech@ptg.org<BR>><BR>>To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit<BR>> https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives<BR>>or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to<BR>> pianotech-request@ptg.org<BR>><BR>>You can reach the person managing the list at<BR>> pianotech-owner@ptg.org<BR>><BR>>When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific<BR>>than "Re: Contents of Pianotech digest..."<BR> <P>>Today's Topics:<BR>><BR>>    1. Rossini's piano (was Chopin's piano) (Clark Panaccione)<BR>>    2. Re: Advice on tuning techniques for recovering tendonitis<BR>>       sufferer (John Formsma)<BR>>    3. RE: Broadwood Bass string (John Delacour)<BR>>    4. Baldassin Sanderson Kimbell Tremper temperament (daniel carlton)<BR>>    5. Re: Broadwood Bass string (Ron Nossaman)<BR>>    6. SV: Re: Chopin's piano (Aras)<BR>>    7. PRCT (ROBERT MIHLFELD)<BR>>    8. Re: Baldassin Sanderson Kimbell Tremper temperament (Don)<BR> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>Clark Panaccione <threesixesinarow@yahoo.com></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>pianotech@ptg.org</I><BR>Subject:  <I>Rossini's piano (was Chopin's piano)</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 07:45:26 -0700 (PDT)</I><BR>>Some discussion about the sound from a Pleyel about<BR>>the same time (there's also a paper about old<BR>>soundboards)<BR>><BR>>Alessandro Cocchi, Flavio Ponzi, Lamberto Tronchin.<BR>>"Acoustic and Dynamic Characterisation of Different<BR>>Hammer-sets in the Rossini Piano Pleyel 'petit a<BR>>queue' Restoration" ISMA1997, Edinburgh<BR>>http://www.ciarm.ing.unibo.it/researches/isma97.html<BR>><BR>>A brochure you can download published by Pleyel<BR>>including an article from 1844 discussing some of<BR>>their features.<BR>><BR>>Ignace Pleyel et cie. "Instructions pour le Déballage,<BR>>l'Entretien et la Conservation des Pianos" Paris, 1850<BR>>http://www.musiques-vivantes.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=blogsection&id=1&Itemid=32<BR>><BR>>Clark<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR>>____________________________________________________________________________________<BR>>8:00? 8:25? 8:40? Find a flick in no time<BR>>with the Yahoo! Search movie showtime shortcut.<BR>>http://tools.search.yahoo.com/shortcuts/#news<BR>><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>"John Formsma" <formsma@gmail.com></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>"Pianotech List" <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>Re: Advice on tuning techniques for recovering tendonitis sufferer</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 09:50:58 -0500</I><BR> <DIV></DIV><BR>Yes, absolutely! I find myself doing this more, whereas I used to sit for nearly all tunings.<BR><BR>JF<BR><BR> <DIV><SPAN class=gmail_quote>On 3/19/07, <B class=gmail_sendername>Jon Page</B> <<A href="mailto:jonpage@comcast.net"> </DIV>jonpage@comcast.net</A>> wrote:</SPAN> <BLOCKQUOTE class=gmail_quote style="PADDING-LEFT: 1ex; MARGIN: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex">Tuning while standing will keep your left arm straighter and not <DIV></DIV><BR>require the same motion as when tuning while sitting.<BR>--<BR><BR>Regards,<BR><BR>Jon Page<BR></BLOCKQUOTE> <DIV></DIV><BR> <DIV></DIV> <DIV></DIV><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>John Delacour <JD@Pianomaker.co.uk></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>annie@allthingspiano.com, Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>RE: Broadwood Bass string</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 17:42:40 +0000</I><BR>>At 8:27 pm -0500 18/3/07, Annie Grieshop wrote:<BR>><BR>>>A related question:  is there a single source of at least general<BR>>>information about the history of wire manufacture and string <BR>>>making?  After<BR>>>listening to Chopin on the 1883 Chickering last week, I questioned <BR>>>how the<BR>>>materials/construction/sound of modern strings differ from what <BR>>>would have<BR>>>been on that piano originally, and nobody could tell me.  Thanks <BR>>>for any<BR>>>pointers........<BR>><BR>>Though I am not familiar with Chickerings, since unfortunately they <BR>>are rare in Europe, an 1883 piano is practically a modern piano and <BR>>very different from the pianos Chopin played, which were pre-1850 <BR>>(the year Henry Steinway moved to America), after which there were <BR>>many hugely important developments, not least in the tensile <BR>>strength of steel wire.  Between 1867 and 1893 Poehlmann set the <BR>>pace for piano wire, so that in 1876 their No. 17 wire broke at 342 <BR>>lbs. compared with Washburn and Moen's 242 lbs.  I guess Chickering <BR>>would have used Poehlmann wire at this time, as most great European <BR>>makers did.  Today's wire is not as good in any way as Poehlmann's <BR>>and has not the same tensile strength, with the result that the <BR>>strings on a piano strung with modern wire will be close to their <BR>>breaking strain, and that is all to the good in some cases.  As to <BR>>the covered strings, unless Chickering originally used iron covering <BR>>wire, there will be very little essential difference.  Steinway used <BR>>iron covering wire at one stage but that was earlier, probably about <BR>>1865.<BR>><BR>>You can reckon the sound of Chopin's Pleyel was very different from <BR>>_any_ 1883 piano.  I made the strings for one of Chopin's pianos <BR>>about 20 years ago and probably still have the scale, as well as <BR>>several others from the period.  Last year I made the strings for a <BR>>piano identical to Chopin's little upright Pleyel using modern (R) <BR>>wire.  My colleague was not happy with the extreme bass, so we <BR>>remade them using a weaker make of core wire and there was a marked <BR>>improvement.<BR>><BR>>Almost certainly the 1883 Chickering will have had more purity and <BR>>clarity than most of today's pianos, many of which I hate to hear, <BR>>especially the hateful Bösendorfer, which makes any melody in the <BR>>bass sound like an earthquake or a washing machine.  In my opinion <BR>>the piano has gone downhill since about 1905.<BR>><BR>>JD<BR>><BR>><BR>><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>"daniel carlton" <hacicspe@gmail.com></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>"pianotech mailing list" <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>Baldassin Sanderson Kimbell Tremper temperament</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 11:31:12 -0500</I><BR> <DIV></DIV><BR> <DIV>hi listers</DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV>anyone know where i can get a copy of the <FONT size=2><FONT face=arial,sans-serif>Baldassin Sanderson Kimbell Tremper temperament? i looked in the archives but couldn't seem to find it.</FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV><FONT size=2></FONT> </DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV>thanks</DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV> </DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV>daniel</DIV> <DIV></DIV> <DIV></DIV><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>Ron Nossaman <rnossaman@cox.net></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>Re: Broadwood Bass string</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 12:23:04 -0600</I><BR>>>Between 1867 and 1893 Poehlmann set the pace for piano wire, so <BR>>>that in 1876 their No. 17 wire broke at 342 lbs. compared with <BR>>>Washburn and Moen's 242 lbs.  I guess Chickering would have used <BR>>>Poehlmann wire at this time, as most great European makers did.  <BR>>>Today's wire is not as good in any way as Poehlmann's and has not <BR>>>the same tensile strength, with the result that the strings on a <BR>>>piano strung with modern wire will be close to their breaking <BR>>>strain, and that is all to the good in some cases.<BR>><BR>><BR>>They must have had different pounds back then. I show today's #17 <BR>>Roslau at 395lb, and #17 Mapes International Gold at 433lb for <BR>>coiled treble wire.<BR>><BR>><BR>>Ron N<BR>><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>Aras <aras6310@yahoo.se></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>SV: Re: Chopin's piano</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 19:38:33 +0100 (CET)</I><BR> <DIV></DIV><BR>It is really nice and interesting to listen to the music on the instruments on which it was actually composed.<BR>I have rebuilded old Erard grands like the one  Chopin once owned and many pianists find that playing the music on these pianos give them a better understanding of the music.<BR>I is of no interest which instrument the old composers would prefer as they had no choice. If Mozart lived today he might have played eletronic pianos and his music would be different.<BR>The old pianos were made for small halls and the major difference to a modern grand is that they have many more "colours" but not the same power as a modern grand. On the other hand you can play from "ppppp" while the modern grand may start on p or pp.<BR><BR><BR><B><I>Jurgen Goering <pianoforte@pianofortesupply.com></I></B> skrev: <BLOCKQUOTE class=replbq style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px">I once had the pleasure of experiencing Beethoven <DIV></DIV>sonatas played on an  <BR>1830s Broadwood concert grand in a piano collector's home.  This piano  <BR>was very similar to what Beethoven would have played and  composed on a  <BR>decade or two earlier.    The instrument had been in good condition  <BR>originally and had been refurbished.<BR><BR>In this case, I was thrilled it wasn't a modern concert grand I was  <BR>hearing.  It was a "goosebumps" experience.<BR><BR>Jurgen Goering<BR>Piano Forte Supply<BR>(250) 754-2440<BR>info@pianofortesupply.com<BR>http://www.pianofortesupply.com<BR><BR><BR>  David Boyce wrote:<BR><BR>> That doesn't answer, of course, what sound Chopin would have LIKED to h <BR>> ear, or whether his  <BR>>  music is BETTER on a modern grand or on one of his time. Personally, I <BR>>  go for the <DIV></DIV> modern concert grand every time!</BLOCKQUOTE><BR> <P> <DIV></DIV> <HR SIZE=1> <BR> <TABLE> <TBODY> <TR> <TD>Stava rätt! Stava lätt! Yahoo! Mails stavkontroll tar hand om tryckfelen och mycket mer! Få den på <A href="http://se.mail.yahoo.com/">http://se.mail.yahoo.com</A></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> <DIV></DIV><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>ROBERT MIHLFELD <mihlfeld@sbcglobal.net></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>Pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>PRCT</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 11:41:55 -0700 (PDT)</I><BR> <DIV></DIV><BR> <DIV>I have listed my Pocket Reyburn Cybertuner on Ebay, following is the link.</DIV>   <DIV> </DIV>   <DIV><A href="http://cgi.ebay.com/Reyburn-Cyber-Tuner-for-PDA_W0QQitemZ330100709023QQcategoryZ182QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item330100709023">http://cgi.ebay.com/Reyburn-Cyber-Tuner-for-PDA_W0QQitemZ330100709023QQcategoryZ182QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem?hash=item330100709023</A></DIV> <DIV></DIV><BR> <P> <P> <HR color=#a0c6e5 SIZE=1> <DIV></DIV>From:  <I>Don <pianotuna@accesscomm.ca></I><BR>Reply-To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>To:  <I>Pianotech List <pianotech@ptg.org></I><BR>Subject:  <I>Re: Baldassin Sanderson Kimbell Tremper temperament</I><BR>Date:  <I>Mon, 19 Mar 2007 12:53:20</I><BR>>Hi Daniel,<BR>><BR>>You can find the Baldassin Sanderson temperament at the accutuner site.<BR>><BR>>http://www.accu-tuner.com/SATIIImanual/sat3manual.html<BR>><BR>>At 11:31 AM 3/19/2007 -0500, you wrote:<BR>> >hi listers   anyone know where i can get a copy of the Baldassin Sanderson<BR>> >Kimbell Tremper temperament? i looked in the archives but couldn't seem<BR>> >to find it.   thanks   daniel No virus found in this incoming message.<BR>> >Checked by AVG Free Edition. Version: 7.5.446 / Virus Database:<BR>> >268.18.14/727 - Release Date: 3/19/2007 11:49 AM<BR>>Regards,<BR>>Don Rose, B.Mus., A.M.U.S., A.MUS., R.P.T.<BR>>Non calor sed umor est qui nobis incommodat<BR>><BR>>mailto:pianotuna@yahoo.com http://us.geocities.com/drpt1948/<BR>><BR>>3004 Grant Rd. REGINA, SK, S4S 5G7<BR>>306-539-0716 or 1-888-29t-uner<BR>><BR> <P> <P> <P>>_______________________________________________<BR>>Pianotech list info https://www.moypiano.com/resources/#archives<BR> <P></FONT></P></BLOCKQUOTE></div><br clear=all><hr> <a href="http://g.msn.com/8HMBENUS/2728??PS=47575" target="_top">Exercise your brain! Try Flexicon.</a> </html>