<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:st1="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <META HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type" CONTENT="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)"> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PostalCode"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="State"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="City"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="place"/> <o:SmartTagType namespaceuri="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:smarttags" name="PersonName"/>  <style>  </style> </head> <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue> <div class=Section1> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>Mike, <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>One thing you must learn about this list is it is full of really smart and opinionated people who aren’t shy about sharing their thoughts. Eat the meat, spit out the bone, thicken your skin, and please keep posting because we can always use another of the above. ;-)<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'>G’day.<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 color=navy face=Arial><span style='font-size: 10.0pt;font-family:Arial;color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <div> <p class=MsoAutoSig><b><font size=6 color=navy face="Bradley Hand ITC"><span style='font-size:22.0pt;font-family:"Bradley Hand ITC";color:navy;font-weight: bold'>Dean</span></font></b><font color=navy><span style='color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoAutoSig style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><u1:PersonName u2:st="on"><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt; color:navy'>Dean May</u1:PersonName>             cell 812.239.3359 <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoAutoSig style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>PianoRebuilders.com   812.235.5272 <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <p class=MsoAutoSig style='margin:0in;margin-bottom:.0001pt'><u1:place u2:st="on"><u1:City u2:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on"><st1:City w:st="on"><font size=3 color=navy face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt;color:navy'>Terre Haute</span></font></st1:City><font color=navy><span style='color:navy'></u1:City> <u1:State u2:st="on"><st1:State w:st="on">IN</u1:State></st1:State>  <u1:PostalCode u2:st="on"><st1:PostalCode w:st="on">47802</u1:PostalCode></st1:PostalCode></span></font></st1:place></u1:place><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> </span></font></div> <p class=MsoNormal><b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Tahoma;font-weight:bold'>From:</span></font></b><font size=2 face=Tahoma><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:Tahoma'> pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>On Behalf Of </span></b>Michael Magness<br> <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Sent:</span></b> Tuesday, September 25, 2007 5:41 PM<br> <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>To:</span></b> <st1:PersonName w:st="on">Pianotech List</st1:PersonName><br> <b><span style='font-weight:bold'>Subject:</span></b> Seating Strings: Putting it to Rest/Out of It's Misery</span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'><o:p> </o:p></span></font></p> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>Below are copies of 3 posts from today, the first from RicB I found to be a reasoned well thought response to what I had to say and I thank him for it. The 2nd from Ed Sutton equally reasoned and well thought I wish to thank him as well. The 3rd from Ron Nossaman who finally admitted to having tried it and went on to explain where I could find more about it in greater detail as a good teacher would, (I talked to Conrad H. and he told me you're a good man Ron), so I want to thank him for doing so. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>I presume the rest of you, in your own way were trying to tell me the same things, however I don't respond well to attack dog style teaching methods. Those of you who prefer that style could learn a thing or two from Ric, Ed and Ron. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>I will apologize for being new to the list and not knowing this was such a touchy subject. If I feel strongly about something I won't shy away from it just because others disagree however if it's been discussed at length already and I have nothing to add but stirring up tempers I see nothing to be gained. <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>So I will allow my post to die away while I do my reading on the subject as suggested by Ron.  <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>Mike<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. - Thomas Edison<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>************************************************************************************************************************<br clear=all> Hi again..<br> <br> Just a couple more thoughts.  In all fairness I would like to point <br> out that one of the most respected techs in all of <st1:place w:st="on">Europe</st1:place>, and a<br> fellow that Steinway Hamburg relies on very heavily for some of their <br> most critical work is of like mind (by all reports I get)to our new<br> friend Mike. Mike by no means stands alone in this thinking, nor does <br> the teacher he referes to with so much respect.<br> <br> I'd also point out that this procedure was one I ran into very early <br> on and used for several years before some of the guys and gals at<br> Sherman Clay in <st1:City w:st="on"><st1:place w:st="on">Seattle</st1:place></st1:City> pointed out to me that perhaps I might think <br> about a few of the consequences that perhaps might not be so<br> desirable that result from this procedure. <br> <br> Then came the Nossaman thinking along in my own life... which took<br> things to the far extreme on the other side.... yet there was a good <br> deal about his reasoning I found and still do quite compelling.<br> <br> My own nature is to seek middle ground... because usually thats where<br> truth lies nearest.  So after quite a bit of pondering I wrote the<br> article that appeared in the journal a couple years back which pretty <br> clearly sums up the problem and what the controversy is all about.  I <br> left it up to each reader to decide whether a string could be<br> unseated in the face of positive downbearing.<br> <br> The initiative I took in starting this post... was the discovery of a <br> very clear and extremely easy way of proving to oneself that that <br> last mentioned can indeed occur.  In which case strings actually do<br> need seating.<br> <br> That said, whatever seating procedure that is used should not be of <br> character that creates an indentation in the bridge that lies below <br> the strings line of deflection.  I'll leave it up to the individual<br> to judge whether or not ones own methods and means do or dont.<br> <br> Cheers<br> RicB<br> ************************************************************************************************************************* <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div bgcolor="#ffffff"> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>Mike-</span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>"String seating," using some kind of tapping or pressing has been a commonly taught procedure for many years, both by individuals teachers and major manufacturers' representatives. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>More recently, in particular due to a better understanding of the effects of humidity on the bridge cap, technicians are beginning to ask if the temporary improvement causes greater long term damage. </span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>Thus, opinions are in a state of change about this.  You will find both views being taught by fine teachers, and you'll hear tempers flare.</span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=2 face=Arial><span style='font-size:10.0pt; font-family:Arial'>Ed Sutton</span></font><o:p></o:p></p> </div> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>******************************************************************************************************************************<br>  <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>  <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>I have tried it, as I expect most of us have at one time or<br> another. Some of us have made an effort to understand what is<br> actually happening when strings are seated, and spent way too<br> much time describing and discussing the phenomenon on list<br> with way too many people who weren't interested in trying to<br> understand what they believed they saw. It's all there in the<br> archives, in excruciating detail, if you're interested. If <br> you're not, I'm not about to waste any more time trying to<br> explain it to you.<br>  <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size:12.0pt'><br> <br> > Never become so much of an expert that you stop gaining expertise. View<br> > life as a continuous learning experience.<br> > - Denis Waitley<o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'>Denis is getting more strident with each  repetition too,<br> incidentally.<br> Ron N<br>  <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> <p class=MsoNormal><font size=3 face="Times New Roman"><span style='font-size: 12.0pt'><br> I have not failed. I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work. -Thomas Edison<br> <br> <br> <br> Michael Magness<br> Magness Piano Service<br> 608-786-4404 <br> <a href="http://www.ifixpianos.com/" target="_blank">www.IFixPianos.com</a> <br> email <a href="mailto:mike@ifixpianos.com" target="_blank">mike@ifixpianos.com</a> <o:p></o:p></span></font></p> </div> </div> </body> </html>