<html><body style="word-wrap: break-word; -webkit-nbsp-mode: space; -webkit-line-break: after-white-space; ">H'mm,<div>Presumably the rail actually contacts in the back (you sometimes have to glue wood back in because you are cutting off the lip).   I haven't noted noise from the solenoid plungers rubbing under the keys, yet...</div><div><br></div><div>A dag or two would eliminate one variable.</div><div><br></div><div>Andrew</div><div><br><div><div>On Sep 26, 2008, at 11:24 AM, <a href="mailto:piannaman@aol.com">piannaman@aol.com</a> wrote:</div><br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"><div> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">Andrew,<br> <br> I don't rely on the dags, but in my limited experience--can't say I'm entirely sure why--several of the pianos I work on that have player systems (dags removed) have creaks/squeaks when the una corda pedal is operated no matter how well I try to bed the keyframe, and no matter where I apply various lubricants.  And they emanate from the area of the piano where the dags are missing.  <br> </font></div> <div> <br> </div> <div id="sig7319" style="clear: both;"><font>Dave Stahl, RPT<br> Dave Stahl Piano Service<br> <a href="mailto:dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net">dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net</a><br> dstahlpiano.net</font></div> <div> <br> </div> <div> <br> </div> -----Original Message-----<br> From: Andrew Anderson <<a href="mailto:anrebe@sbcglobal.net">anrebe@sbcglobal.net</a>><br> To: Pianotech List <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>><br> Sent: Fri, 26 Sep 2008 6:16 am<br> Subject: Re: Another player system question<br> <br> <div id="AOLMsgPart_2_6e82dc5e-9088-4002-90bc-58241676bded"> Without referring to my notes I recall exposing about 1/2" of key-end and that the key-bed mortice was about 1/8" more.  The dags we used were metal 'C' shaped affairs (screwed to the keybed on the front, leading edge) and we morticed them into the keybed and notched the back-rail accordingly with room for the keyframe to shift.  Mind-you, this is all easier to do when the keybed is up on horses. <div><br> </div> <div>I remember on player crew from a manufacturer was attending and they said, "We used to just throw them away."  Mr. Zarate pointed out that that would void many manufacturer's warranties.  They now have experience with an alternative.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>How many of you actually rely on the dags for bedding?  I wasn't taught that way.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>Andrew Anderson, Artisan Piano</div> <div><br> <div> <div>On Sep 25, 2008, at 10:51 PM, <a href="mailto:piannaman@aol.com">piannaman@aol.com</a> wrote:</div> <br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"> <div> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">Hi Andrew,<br> <br> Thanks for the information.  I suspected that the dags should be put back in the piano.  How much of the key frame is cut off, usually?  <br> <br> Even if one doesn't want to install these units, knowing how to troubleshoot them could be useful and possibly lucrative.  <br> </font></div> <div> <br> </div> <div id="sig2551" style="clear: both;"><font>Dave Stahl, RPT<br> Dave Stahl Piano Service<br> <a href="mailto:dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net">dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net</a><br> dstahlpiano.net</font></div> <div> <br> </div> <div> <br> </div> -----Original Message-----<br> From: Andrew Anderson <<a href="mailto:anrebe@sbcglobal.net">anrebe@sbcglobal.net</a>><br> To: Pianotech List <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>><br> Sent: Thu, 25 Sep 2008 2:13 pm<br> Subject: Re: Another player system question<br> <br> <div id="AOLMsgPart_2_29fa127b-e6c4-4201-b973-5fec4ef69012"> Dave <div>We addressed this at a class at PianoDisc Sacramento.  We moved the dags forward to the new keyframe edge making all the necessary adjustments as well as checking the bedding.  This really is an installer quality issue.  Some installers don't have any regulation know-how and don't have any idea if or why anything is wrong.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>As a dealer I've had to go through QRS equipped pianos from one source and work on just about everything.</div> <div><br> </div> <div>As a technician this is an opportunity to really shine if you aren't intimidated by those "blinking lights."</div> <div><br> </div> <div>YMMV,</div> <div>Andrew Anderson, Artisan Piano</div> <div><br> <div> <div>On Sep 25, 2008, at 9:18 AM, <a href="mailto:piannaman@aol.com">piannaman@aol.com</a> wrote:</div> <br class="Apple-interchange-newline"><blockquote type="cite"> <div> <font face="Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif">I'm not sure about that, Phil.  But I am sure that one of the pianos I work on that has key bedding / una corda squeak issues (dags removed) is a Boston GP 178.  So please, be careful when you chop on that puppy!</font><br> </div> <div> <br> </div> <div id="sig9382" style="clear: both;"><font>Dave Stahl, RPT<br> Dave Stahl Piano Service<br> <a href="mailto:dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net">dstahlpiano@sbcglobal.net</a><br> dstahlpiano.net</font></div> <div> <br> </div> <div> <br> </div> -----Original Message-----<br> From: Phil Bondi <<a href="mailto:phil@philbondi.com">phil@philbondi.com</a>><br> To: Newtonville <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>><br> Sent: Wed, 24 Sep 2008 3:00 pm<br> Subject: Another player system question<br> <br> <div id="AOLMsgPart_0_c747b4dc-beae-4ff7-8393-9c1afeffa01e" style="margin: 0px; font-family: Tahoma,Verdana,Arial,Sans-Serif; font-size: 12px; color: rgb(0, 0, 0); background-color: rgb(255, 255, 255);"> Does anyone know if the Boston GP178's keybed is easily removed for solenoid installation? <br>  <br> Thanks, <br>  <br> -Phil Bondi(Fl) <br> </div> <div id="u8CAED30C2E4CC90-17BC-D3A" class="aol_ad_footer"><font style="color: black; font-family: ARIAL,SAN-SERIF; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal;"><hr style="margin-top: 10px;">Find phone numbers fast with the <a title="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001" target="_blank" href="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001">New AOL Yellow Pages</a>!</font> </div> </blockquote></div> <br> </div> = </div> <div id="u8CAEDA2398E3523-ED0-3DCF" class="aol_ad_footer"><font style="color: black; font-family: ARIAL,SAN-SERIF; font-style: normal; font-variant: normal; font-weight: normal; font-size: 10pt; line-height: normal; font-size-adjust: none; font-stretch: normal; -x-system-font: none;"><hr style="margin-top: 10px;">Find phone numbers fast with the <a title="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001" target="_blank" href="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001">New AOL Yellow Pages</a>!</font> </div> </blockquote></div> <br> </div> = </div>  <div id="u8CAEE0B87CD150D-5C4-3E2D" class="aol_ad_footer"><font style="color: black; font: normal 10pt ARIAL, SAN-SERIF;"><hr style="MARGIN-TOP: 10px">Find phone numbers fast with the <a title="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001" href="http://yellowpages.aol.com/?NCID=emlweusyelp00000001" target="_blank">New AOL Yellow Pages</a>!</font> </div></blockquote></div><br></div></body></html>