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<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I thought about agraffes. I doubt the bridge is
wide enough to fit them far enough forward to make a difference.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>We need pictures!</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Why are some of us so interested in problems like
this? </FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Ed</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=gravagnegang@att.net href="mailto:gravagnegang@att.net">Nick
Gravagne</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=ed440@mindspring.com
href="mailto:ed440@mindspring.com">'Ed Sutton'</A> ; <A
title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">'Pianotech List'</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Thursday, October 09, 2008 3:10
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: [Fwd: Re: [Fwd: Re:
Unstringable C8, was Steinway 78183]]</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Interesting idea Ed.
But I wonder about sizzles as the pins and brass “notch” would not align. May
not matter, though.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Gives me a thought,
however. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">What about removing
the pins and plugging holes. Then, using a Forstner bit bore in a clean
countersunk hole of appropriate depth. Finally, drill and tap to install
agraffes. This way the string lengths can be easily established as well as
bearing etc. I think I might consider this before recapping. And, in any
event, should recapping be required no harm has been
done.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">BTW, my last sign off
should have read “respectfully” not “respectively”.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Nick
Gravagne, RPT</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Piano
Technicians Guild</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Member
Society Manufacturing Engineers</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Voice
Mail 928-476-4143</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: windowtext">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Ed Sutton<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Thursday, October 09, 2008 10:30
AM<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> <st1:PersonName
w:st="on">Pianotech List</st1:PersonName><BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> Re: [Fwd: Re: [Fwd: Re:
Unstringable C8, was Steinway 78183]]</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Two thoughts:
</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: windowtext"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">1)What is the
friction under the bearing bar? The highest string tension in the system will
be between the tuning pin and the bearing bar. Is the bar rough, or tightened
down too far? Perhaps some good lubrication on the bar would help. At one time
Steinway was applying a heavy white grease to the pressure bar, if I remember
correctly.</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: windowtext"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">2)Since these
are notes 87 and 88, which aren't very pretty in the best cases, is there
enough notch on the bridge to try sliding a little piece of brass rod on the
edge of the bridge, to make a forward termination? Not classy, but quick out
of sight, and likely to be held in place by gravity assist on a
vertical.</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: windowtext"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Ed
Sutton</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; PADDING-LEFT: 4pt; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; MARGIN: 5pt 0in 5pt 3.75pt; BORDER-LEFT: black 1.5pt solid; PADDING-TOP: 0in; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">-----
Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV style="font-color: black">
<P class=MsoNormal style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4"><B><FONT face=Arial
color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <A
title=gravagnegang@att.net href="mailto:gravagnegang@att.net">Nick
Gravagne</A> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">.........</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">So, given that the
string lengths need to be shorted in this area, the real question to the
List is “what is the easiest and least costly way to do this”? And this is
where the List shines brightest. But without photos and some measurements we
don’t have enough information.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=navy
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">......</SPAN></FONT><FONT
face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"> </SPAN></FONT><FONT face=Arial color=navy
size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Lastly, and I say
this with a grin and sincerity, you might consider doing nothing and simply
accepting the fact that the top two notes must be tuned flat – kind of like
your piano has a bit of arthritis or a bit of a bad back. I have a door in
my house that won’t latch right. I could spend a day fixing it, or even
replacing it, but I live with it and it doesn’t bother me. But that’s me.
The door thing might bother you a lot, as this piano thing might as well.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial">Respectively,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Nick
Gravagne, RPT</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Piano
Technicians Guild</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Member
Society Manufacturing Engineers</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT
color=navy><SPAN style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoAutoSig><EM><B><I><FONT face="Trebuchet MS" color=navy
size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Trebuchet MS'">Voice
Mail 928-476-4143</SPAN></FONT></I></B></EM><FONT color=navy><SPAN
style="COLOR: navy"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face=Arial color=navy size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: Arial"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><FONT
face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt; COLOR: windowtext">
<HR tabIndex=-1 align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><FONT face=Tahoma color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">From:</SPAN></FONT></B><FONT
face=Tahoma color=black size=2><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: windowtext; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma">
pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">On Behalf Of </SPAN></B>Leslie
Bartlett<BR><B><SPAN style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Sent:</SPAN></B> Thursday,
October 09, 2008 6:02 AM<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">To:</SPAN></B> pianotech@ptg.org<BR><B><SPAN
style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold">Subject:</SPAN></B> [Fwd: Re: [Fwd: Re:
Unstringable C8, was Steinway 78183]]</SPAN></FONT><FONT color=black><SPAN
style="COLOR: windowtext"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><FONT face="Times New Roman" color=black size=3><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><FONT face="Times New Roman"
color=black size=3><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt">This trust issue is a big
thing. This from the lady who's top string broke on the Steinway
vertical. I forwarded all the pianotech posts to these folks- trust
and respect at least sometimes coming from honest admission that a problem
is beyond one's ability, but s/he will do their darndest to find a solution.
Now, I just wish we could find that solution! Extending the
bridge closer to the capo seems like a reasonable possibility, huh? It
wouldn't require an entire design of a very old, and mostly nicely rebuilt
piano.<BR>les b<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></P>
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style="FONT-SIZE: 12pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></P><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Dear Les,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">This is Mary writing; Jerry showed me the correspondence you forwarded to him about key 88 on our Steinway. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thank you for submitting this problem for consideration by the group, and for forwarding to us their insights and ideas. Reading these discussions is fascinating as well as helpful: we get a glimpse of piano workings, and also see the interest and concern of so many knowledgeable people on this question.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">You made an excellent difference in the piano, and we appreciate it. The action is noticeably improved, as well as the tuning. I have been playing it faithfully every day, at least some chromatic scales. You are right; it definitely responds to use.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Thank you for your good work. I am so happy that Carl recommended you.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Best regards,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt">Mary Ochoa <o:p></o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE><PRE><FONT face="Courier New" color=black size=2><SPAN style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></FONT></PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>