<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12 (filtered medium)">  <style>  </style>  </head> <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple> <div class=Section1> I agree with Dale:<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> I think a good hammer voicer is above all a pragmatist who has a large bag of tricks at his hand.  Whatever gets you where you want to go for the tonal result you are seeking is good.  We have to be able to play the hand that we are dealt, even with very good hammers of our own choosing.  Too many technicians have unrealistic expectations of what piano hammers can and should do.  They want hammers to be absolutely consistent within a set  and from set to set.  That never happens in the real world.   Felt is an organic material and is variable.  Even the best hammer sets that I have had require a fair amount of work to reach their full and glorious potential.  <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Different voicers can have different voicing protocols because they have developed their skills in an individualized way after much experience.  They develop an evolved tonal memory that comes from years of listening, listening, listening.  And the call and response of the voicing act – you do and the hammer gives you back its reaction to your applied hand.  It’s a joyful act to thus bring the piano alive.  And it is something you can and should take genuine pride in – after all, you are giving the piano its VOICE.           <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Like Dale, the first thing I do with a new set of hammers is poke it with a needle to see how it feels.  The touch sensitivity which comes from years of needling hammers will tell you when the felt is good.  There is a feeling of some resistance but also a springy feel of resilience that you can feel through the needle.  If it feels right, it usually will sound pretty good.  <o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> I will be hanging a set of these hammers on a Mason & Hamlin A in a couple of weeks.  I have the set already, and they have passed the needle test.  I’m salivating now, after hearing all these good reports.  Can’t wait to get some noise out of that piano.<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> Will Truitt<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'> From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of erwinspiano@aol.com Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 7:27 PM To: pianotech@ptg.org Subject: Re: The all new Weickert felt hammer by Ronsen<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p>   Thank you Tom   Beautiful post full of wisdom gleaned from hard fought experience. I believe this may help Andrew & Paul to develop their pianos without spending all the money to start over. Rule of thumb. Big piano are like high maintenance race cars/horses/Women. grin.  We simply learn to treat them in a way that maximizes there performance. Anyone agree?   I truly hope all will re-read Toms sage & succinct post here. It seems like every time I hear someone saying that  juice was required to get a tone, it's stated  as if this was an negative consequence. And yet when someone says they had to needle each hammer about 50 times a side it appears that this is just some form of accepted elbow & wrist torture that one must go thru to get the Golden tone. And yet obviously needling is required in many pianos and is valid method for voicing hammers.    The fact that a hammer felt requires this much acupuncture is an indicator that much of natural properties we rely on for tone may have been killed in pressing, or the felt wasn't that good to begin with.   As Tom points out on some of the Wurzen AA sets you file less, sometimes more.  Is this also a negative consequence? We know it isn't. It's a step in the final tone development. SO, some needling & some juicing is  required on many occasions and it is a necessary skill set that each of us must embrace on the journey in the voicing art form when becoming a true voicer. If we do not we may erroneously conlude that some hammer or another isn't any good or can't get there when in fact we haven't given it a fair hearing with the appropriate voicing protocols    There is a Golden tone that a medium density hammer can produce with a light solution that many of us will state catagorically can not be produced in hard pressed hammers, And as Tom said the next person will not know by the feel of the needle, a hammer so treated, that any solution has been applied.  This one of the Beauties of the Ronsen way of making hammers. They are right there close to the tonal mark that Samuel Wolfendon describes refers to in his book "The Treatise on the art of Piano Forte construction". page 151 -152. "The hammer should require only mild needling to open up the hammer"  Yes I learned that felt is hollow from Jack. Why we didn't know this before I dunno...but, It explains why wool felt retains so much water. The fibers can fill up retain much water weight.    I've always held that adding solutions to felt simply coated and stiffened the outside of the fiber but I now know that adding juice also stiffens the fiber on the inside as well, and because the felt was made and kept alive and springy, adding solutions to felt can stiffen fibers on the inside which works  very well for our voicing purposes, without the resilience being compromised. Sorry about the run ons.    It's really all a balancing act of hammer felt stiffness the we  juggle with our voicing protocols as we approach our target tone on a specific piano in a specific acoustic environment. SO crucial to remember this.    Heres' my felt test when I receive a new set of hammers from wherever. I use a no. 6 needle as a probe to test the density of the hammer. If the needle goes half way in & stops as it hits a hardened mass they go back. The felt is unworkable.  Conversely if they are too soft they also go back. This is an excellent way anybody can learn to pre judge a set of hammers before they get to the point of no return where consternation & gnashing of teeth ensues.     Hope this helps. Hope no one is doing the teeth grind on my account  Sincerely   Dale Erwin   <o:p></o:p> <div id="AOLMsgPart_2_961d2d9e-3106-4d77-a603-b4e08634de0d"> <div> Paul<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> As someone who has installed about as many sets of Wurzen hammers in the USA as anybody, I too have found that the Wurzen hammers need juicing for the larger instruments.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> I've settled in on a 10:1 lacquer solution which adds just some extra support but not strong enough to affect needling or  diminish the elasticity issues. Anyone who would have checked to the piano afterwards would be hard-pressed to know that any additives were added.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> That being said, once juiced, the hammers perform beautifully and develop into a very musical quality. I've been quite pleased with the results.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> As with any hammer, half the battle is learning what you have to work with. Some require very little filing while others require a heavy filing. Some a lot of needling, some very little.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Another little tid bit that I recently learned from Dale Erwin is that the fibers of the wool are actually hollow, something that was discovered in the R&R labs. Adding solutions to the hammer actually fills the fibers up and causes the fibers to react differently. You learn something new everyday!<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> I too am thrilled to have the Weickert felt back into production. It's about time that rebuilders have some real arsenal to deal with.<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Tom Servinsky<o:p></o:p> </div> <blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt; margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'> <div> ----- Original Message ----- <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> From: <a href="mailto:pwilliams4@unlnotes.unl.edu" title="pwilliams4@unlnotes.unl.edu">Paul T Williams</a> <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> To: <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org" title="pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech List</a> <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 5:12 PM<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Subject: Re: The all new Weickert felt hammer by Ronsen<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <o:p> </o:p> </div> I'm all ears for that as well!!  I love the naturals from Wally!!  I recently put Ronsen-Wurzen on our Baldwin D, but I had to really juice them a lot to get anything out of them, and the techs that responded said otherwise.  what's up with that???  They were more like raw Ronsens, which I would expected.  They sound great now, but it was a hassle!!!  I also Wapinized the bridges and you wouldn't believe the difference.. Glad I did it!! Paul' <o:p></o:p> <table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellpadding=0 width="100%" style='width:100.0%'> <tr> <td width="40%" valign=top style='width:40.0%;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> Andrew Anderson <<a href="mailto:anrebe@sbcglobal.net">anrebe@sbcglobal.net</a>> Sent by: <a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org">pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a> <o:p></o:p> <div> 10/14/2008 12:28 PM <o:p></o:p> <table class=MsoNormalTable border=1 cellpadding=0> <tr> <td valign=top style='background:white;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> Please respond to Pianotech List <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>><o:p></o:p> </td> </tr> </table> </div> </td> <td width="59%" valign=top style='width:59.0%;padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> <table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellpadding=0 width="100%" style='width:100.0%'> <tr> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> To<o:p></o:p> </td> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> Pianotech List <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>> <o:p></o:p> </td> </tr> <tr> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> cc<o:p></o:p> </td> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'></td> </tr> <tr> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> Subject<o:p></o:p> </td> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'> Re: The all new Weickert felt  hammer by Ronsen<o:p></o:p> </td> </tr> </table> <o:p> </o:p> <table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellpadding=0> <tr> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'></td> <td valign=top style='padding:.75pt .75pt .75pt .75pt'></td> </tr> </table> </td> </tr> </table> How do these compare to Abel Naturals?  Or the Wurzen AAA felt hammers from Ronson? Andrew Anderson On Oct 14, 2008, at 9:09 AM, AlliedPianoCraft wrote: Dale!!!!   Now you've gotten me all excited!   I'll have to go and find a piano that needs new hammers.   Al Guecia     From: <a href="mailto:erwinspiano@aol.com">erwinspiano@aol.com</a> Sent: Tuesday, October 14, 2008 9:40 AM To: <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a> Subject: The all new Weickert felt hammer by Ronsen    I wanted to announce this exciting bit of news here first.  Sincerely  Dale Erwin   Ronsen Piano Hammer Company announces   the New Weickert felt limited edition piano hammer.         Exclusively produced in America by the Ronsen Hammer Co.  The Wurzen felt company of Germany has just reintroduced the legendary Weickert felt. This felt was prized by hammer piano makers for its resilience & tonal versatility.    Weickert felt was in use by many famous makers for nearly 90 years before WW-II forced the plant to be shut down. All old N.Y. Steinways as well as many other American and European companies used this felt.  When the Berlin Wall came down, the Jack Brand family of Canada purchased the facility and in 1992 began felt production with all the original equipment and felt making formulas still intact! Wurzen makes a host of piano felts for the industry and its products are marketed and used worldwide.   Now the Famous Weickert felt piano hammer has been recreated. It is a dense,springy felt that provides a rich palette of tonal coloration to the musician and technician.   Ronsen-made Weickert felt hammers elicit enormous sustain and tonal clarity from the very first moment - and these attributes are present without pre-needling. A simple probing of these hammers with a single #6 needle reveals a wonderful dense feel, and the needles go all the way in with a beautiful feel of velvety compliance.  The Weikert-style felt by Wurzen utilizes a special proprietary blend of wools as did the original formulas. The reduction of protocols known to damage felt fibers in production, such as over-bleaching, pressing, ironing and sanding have all been reduced or in large part eliminated, leaving an absolutely beautiful organic hammer. The felt even smells alive! The Weickert felt's density, elasticity and strength are left intact and are the vital and necessary ally of discriminating voicing technicians.  Weickert felt, combined with the time-tested traditional hammer-making protocols of Ronsen's Ray Negron, has now produced one of the finest piano hammers ever available. Available October 23 thd. Order now.   Priced at $330.00 for 16 lb. felt   Priced at $315 for the 14 lb. felt    Introductory price of $299.00   Boring extra   For purchases, services, molding and other felt options call Dale Erwin, Ronsen's new West Coast supplier, at Erwin Piano Restoration at 209-577-8397 Pacific West coast time. For voicing and technical support, call either Dale or Ray Negron at Ronsen at 1-800-864-0233 East Coast time. <o:p></o:p> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center> </div> McCain or Obama? Stay updated on coverage of the Presidential race while you browse - <a href="http://toolbar.aol.com/elections/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000002" target="_blank">Download Now!</a> <o:p></o:p> </blockquote> </div> <div id=MAILCIAMA012-5bac48f538c03b7> <o:p> </o:p> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='margin-top:7.5pt;text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center> </div> McCain or Obama? Stay updated on coverage of the Presidential race while you browse - <a href="http://toolbar.aol.com/elections/download.html?ncid=emlweusdown00000002">Download Now!</a> <o:p></o:p> </div> </div> </body> </html>