I'm all in your favor, Mr. Schecter:   Duaine: Get on or get out!  Or, at least, if you're not a member, just cruise through for free, like you've always done, get your information, and don't respond!  I, for one, am tired of leaches. Paul <table width=100%> <tr valign=top> <td>From: <td>Mark Schecter <mark@schecterpiano.com> <tr valign=top> <td>To: <td>"pianotech@ptg.org" <pianotech@ptg.org> <tr valign=top> <td>Date: <td>06/09/2011 03:34 PM <tr valign=top> <td>Subject: <td>Re: [pianotech] New Website - New Forum Site</table> <hr noshade> <tt>Duaine, I meant members of PTG. They're entitled to discuss internal matters such as costs, and can freely join PTG-l.  Non-members of PTG don't pay anything anyway, so they have no say. If they want to access or contribute to discussions about internal matters, they'll have to ante up like the rest of us. -- Mark Schecter, RPT On Jun 9, 2011, at 1:11 PM, Duaine Hechler <dahechler@att.net> wrote: > Mark, > > Sorry, but you read into more than you should have - I'm talking about - all - members - not just the members of the "-l" list > > Duaine > > On 06/09/2011 02:50 PM, Mark Schecter wrote: >> I don't see why it should be of any concern whatsoever to a non-member. >> >> -- Mark Schecter >> >> >> >> On Jun 9, 2011, at 12:19 PM, Duaine Hechler<dahechler@att.net>  wrote: >> >>> WRONG ! >>> >>> This concerns EVERYONE not just people on the ptg-l list. >>> >>> On 06/09/2011 12:25 PM, J Patrick Draine wrote: >>>> Hi Will, >>>> Your question "what's the cost" should best be discussed on ptg-l. >>>> Patrick >>>> >>>> On Thursday, June 9, 2011, Encore Pianos<encorepianos@metrocast.net>   wrote: >>>>> Dear Phil: I must say at the outset that I am still not much of a fan of the new website.  Familiarity has not increased my enthusiasm, particularly for the new my.ptg.org for the pianotech forum.  I continue to have the feeling that the new system is less friendly,  more work to use, and too often just a pain in the ass.  It struck me as mind bending that you would launch a new website and forum with so little in the way of help files.  Ok, here you are this new thing to use, but we’re not going to tell you much about how to use it.  Figure that out yourself.  It’s now 4 months later and we have a “User Help Group” who, bless their souls, who have figured out a way to do things and are willing to share it with us.  It took me about 10 minutes to find it (finally!!), after clicking into my.ptg.org, clicking on Home and then FAQ – help information. Scroll down to my.ptg.org and there is down on the list barely visible.  Nowhere else does it even tell you that it exists!  THERE IS NOTHING ON THE FACE PAGE THAT TELLS YOU WHERE TO FIND THE HELP FILES..   It just seems like poor layout design to me.  Why is there no HELP on the masthead along with HOME, DIRECTORY, etc.?  Virtually every other software programs has HELP in a clearly visible place at the first tier of the ladder.  And it seems clear that the most logical place for the “User Help Group” would be a sub heading under HELP along with FAQ-help information, instead of being buried somewhere else where you have to chase around until you are lucky enough to stumble on it.  Then you forgot where you found it and have to chase it down again later.  Good interface design is simple, direct, and seemingly intuitive – there seems to be a natural order to it.  Not here.   I have been wondering for some time where the archives are and had no clue how to get to them from the new website.  </tt><a href=https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/><tt>https://www.moypiano.com/ptg/pianotech.php/</tt></a><tt>  is where to go, which by happenstance I stumbled on reading a post on searching the archives.  I understand that the new website is still    incomplete, but until there is a new place for the archives, how hard would it be to post a link in an obvious place for the time being so that someone lacking my instance of dumb luck would actually be able to find it without too much trouble? I know that this is a generic software package sold to organizations like ours.  A lot of navigational needs will be similar for many organizations.  But most will still require some customization that addresses those places where they have specific needs.  I don’t think that nearly enough legwork has been done to completely meet our needs It is my impression that fewer people are using the new pianotech forum.  I have no numbers, but it seems like usage has dropped by half or more.  We are certainly not seeing those hundred posts a day or more that we had seen as recently as a few months ago.  Are people voting with their virtual feet?  When you do so little to help people to use  the website and the forum, I think you are shoveling dirt onto your chances for widespread usage and success.   I have long regarded the pianotech forum as one of our most valuable resources and have begun to fear that it is becoming something less than it has been in the past. I am really curious.  HOW MUCH DID THIS SOFTWARE PACKAGE COST OUR ORGANIZATION?  I have not seen those figures anywhere. Will Truitt From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [</tt><a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org"><tt>mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</tt></a><tt>] On Behalf Of Phil Bondi >>>>> Sent: Thursday, June 09, 2011 9:17 AM >>>>> To: Pianotech@ptg.org; caut@ptg.org; ptg-l@ptg.org >>>>> Subject: [pianotech] New Website - New Forum Site >>>>> Hi all. >>>>> >>>>> Many of you may be getting this email more than once, if so please accept my apologies for that. I am trying to save myself a step or two. >>>>> >>>>> First: If you have not been to the new website - </tt><a href=www.ptg.org><tt>www.ptg.org</tt></a><tt>, please take a moment and take a look. Much time and effort from many different sources have put together a public website we hope you are pleased with. Navigate through the pages, and if there are any questions, I will be happy to answer them, or direct you to the correct source for the answer. >>>>> >>>>> Second: In case you haven't heard, we have a new web-based forum for our discussions. All of the discussions that are presently on this server, and then some, are now available at </tt><a href=www.my.ptg.org><tt>www.my.ptg.org</tt></a><tt>. That site will be replacing this one very soon. Please make your way there and sign up for the discussions that would interest you. Instructions are available, help if needed is available and there is a "User Help Group" of members who have been using that forum for a few months. There is also a FAQ (located under the Home tab), and a "Getting Started" section at the top left of the page. Again, alot of work has been done to the site to make the transition as easy as possible. I anticipate some questions and some confusion. This is not uncommon with a new way of doing things. Change can be disconcerting, but there is plenty of help available. All you have to do is ask. >>>>> >>>>> I am sure you will find the website a member benefit, easy to navigate with very informative content, and an up-to-the-minute capability that is new to the organization. >>>>> >>>>> Again, if there are questions, please feel free to ask. I can be reached at >>>>> phil@philbondi.com >>>>> >>>>> I look forward to seeing all of you at my.ptg.org very soon. >>>>> >>>>> -Phil >>> >>> -- >>> Duaine Hechler >>> Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ >>> Tuning, Servicing&   Rebuilding >>> Reed Organ Society Member >>> Florissant, MO 63034 >>> (314) 838-5587 >>> dahechler@att.net >>> </tt><a href=www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com><tt>www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com</tt></a><tt> >>> -- >>> Home&   Business user of Linux - 11 years >>> >>> >>> > > > -- > Duaine Hechler > Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ > Tuning, Servicing&  Rebuilding > Reed Organ Society Member > Florissant, MO 63034 > (314) 838-5587 > dahechler@att.net > w </tt>