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<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Hi Will,</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Your message came through here on the old
list.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>I have not as yet changed to the new
format.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Sort of refreshing to not have over 100 posts to
read every day >g<</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial> What was the cost of the Reveley
gauge?</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>I am dealing with a 1931 S&S 'B' That has a 5
second sustain on C4</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Nice crown above the C5 but flat as a pancake in
the tenor.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>As measured with my string level, so not very
precise.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Local Boise dealer thinks that it is a voicing
issue.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>New Hammers and wips (not S&S) so I am a little
leery of their advice.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial>Wish we had a good second opinion near
us.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT size=2 face=Arial></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV>Joe Goss BSMusEd MMusEd RPT<BR><A
href="mailto:imatunr@srvinet.com">imatunr@srvinet.com</A><BR><A
href="http://www.mothergoosetools.com">www.mothergoosetools.com</A></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"
dir=ltr>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="FONT: 10pt arial; BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=encorepianos@metrocast.net
href="mailto:encorepianos@metrocast.net">Encore Pianos</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=pianotech@ptg.org
href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 22, 2011 6:17
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [pianotech] Soundboard
Analysis</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV class=WordSection1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">Hi David:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I’m going to throw in my 1 ½
cents here for what it’s worth to you and others. I do some things a
little different than you do.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">Let me start by saying that I
think there are better ways to measure crown than the method you
describe. I used to measure by way of the string method more or less as
you do. It’s slow, awkward, and probably not terribly precise.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">About a year ago, I bought a
Crownulator from Jude Reveley. It is made up of a 1 ‘ long steel bar
accurately flattened on one side. In its center is a hole through which
passes the moveable foot of a dial gauge. You lay the bar square on the
panel next to the rib. As long as there is positive bearing, the dial
gauge foot will move a distance that will be measured on the dial. It’s
a mirror image reading, so if the gauge is reading .080 (of a full circle of
.100), this means that you have .020 of crown over that 1’ span. There
is a formula by which you can drop the numbers in and calculate the crown for
the rib.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I use it when putting in new
boards too. After the board is glued in and otherwise ready to go for
stringing, I take a crown reading on as many ribs as I can get at and record
those measurements. When setting bearing, drive the board down and take
crown readings til I get my target of 50% deflection. Record those
measures. Then string and tune the piano, measure crown again and see
how well I guessed in the process<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I think you would find the
Crownulator significantly more accurate, quicker, and far easier to use.
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I am going to speculate that the
reason the measured crown does not change when there is a positive change in
bearing is that the method of measuring crown is insufficiently precise, it is
too easy to deflect the string and the gauge is too crude to reflect what may
be happening. By way of contrast, the bar of the crownulator is
rigid, and the dial is sensitive enough to reflect small changes in your hand
pressure on the tool and any accidental roll you might introduce in your
awkward state on the floor. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I have a Wixey gauge and use
that, but I have for 30 years or more used a Fowler dial gauge that I bought
from APSCO way back when. I would take 13 downbearing readings
along the bridges, let the tension off the strings and remove them except for
my samples and measure again. Plenty of boards out there where the
bearing did not change at all from loaded to unloaded, and usually little or
no crown down below. More movement at the ends, although the pattern of
the readings would vary from piano to piano. It doesn’t tell you
everything about downbearing, but if you use it consistently it can tell you a
lot quickly and precisely. <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I can combine that with my Wixey
readings.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">Shim to restore crown? I
doubt it does anything meaningful. Has anyone who advocates this as a
rebuilding method taken precise before and after measurements, and followed
that up a few months later with more measurements?
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">Will
Truitt<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black">I hope this gets through.
Too many of my posts disappear into the ether in this new but not improved
system we have.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN style="COLOR: black"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'; FONT-SIZE: 10pt">
pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>David Love<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, June 22, 2011 12:12 PM<BR><B>To:</B>
pianotech@ptg.org<BR><B>Subject:</B> [pianotech] Soundboard
Analysis<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>You might need html to view this.<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>Below is a chart that I use for soundboard analysis.
Measurements are taken before and after taking the tension down. Crown
sections are measured between the ribs using a string stretched as far as
possible and a wedge gauge (very low tech). I try and correspond the
measurement of the crown with the downbearing measurements in terms of
location. An analysis of the soundboard rib design can also be made
using the rib dimensions—I haven’t done that yet. Downbearing
measurements are Lowell gauge readings. Note that .0175 corresponds to
about 1 degree. <o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>I won’t tell you what my conclusion was about this
soundboard but you might be able to guess. (Steinway
AIII)<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>Question to ponder: Why would it be that although
there is a positive change in downbearing when the tension comes off there is
no apparent change in measured crown? Also note (not included in the
data below) that when measuring the change in distance from the struts to the
bridge in the upper end of the piano (from about rib #6 to the top) the
average change was about 1 mm (the board rose about 1 mm).
<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal>BTW this board had received a lot of shimming perhaps with
the idea of restoring crown??? What do you think?<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P
class=MsoNormal>Rib#
Crown
DB
w-ten/wo Rib
L H W
(mm)<o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P class=MsoNormal>Or
section w-ten/
wo-ten<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>1
2/2
.006/.015
600
17
28<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>2
2/2
.006/.015
790
20
27<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>3
2/2
.009/.012
940
20
27<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>4
1.5/2.5
-.006/.003
1040
20
27<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>5
0/.5
-.003/.003
1080
22
27<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>6
0/0
-.009/.006
1120
21
27<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>7
0/0
.006/.018
940
21
26<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>8
0/0
.006/.021
660
20
25<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P
class=MsoNormal>
<o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>9
0/0
.006/.027
560
20
18
<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>10
0/0
.018/.042
390
18
23<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>11
0/0
.022/.045
340
17
23<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<DIV
style="BORDER-BOTTOM: windowtext 1pt solid; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-BOTTOM: 1pt; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: medium none; BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 0in">
<P
class=MsoNormal>12
0/0
.025/.050
270
16
23<o:p></o:p></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText>David Love<o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><A
href="http://www.davidlovepianos.com">www.davidlovepianos.com</A><o:p></o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoPlainText><o:p> </o:p></P></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>