<html> <body> I'm trying to walk a line that might get me in trouble, though, at the moment, I can't see how.  (I wrote that earlier.  I'm already starting to see how.) I might end up breaching some protocol with regard to quoting/copying/paraphrasing across list-borders,  or seen as intentionally fanning discord.   Whatever.  In fact, I'm trying to push the content of the discussion while being mindful of the structure within which the discussion is taking place.  Joe Garrett (in his Report from the Dark Side) may be correct in his assessment of the web-forum's ultimate viability, but I'm not sure his stance in refusing to engage with it, on principle, is the most effective strategy, but that's not my point, and I hope that thought does not become an energy-sapping tangent. The re-posted - post?- of Ron's that I posted (?) to the User Help Group of the web-forum yesterday has generated some renewed discussion there.  I'm hoping it can remain civil long enough to work through answers that often don't seem adequate, which has seemed the case for a long time.  I know I may be understating, but the emotions are intense and it doesn't seem to take much to derail any even potentially useful interaction.  For those of you who can and have not done so, it is probably worth revisiting the 'registration' process, since, as PTG members, (those of you who are), you are disenfranchising yourselves by not having access to the TWO lists where your opinions are heard: User Help Group and PTG-L, the official venue for PTG business, which, to my understanding, can ONLY be accessed through the web forum. Joe G may disagree with me.  I'll ask him. David Skolnik Hastings on Hudson, NY </body> </html>