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</o:shapelayout></xml><![endif]--></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Thanks for all the responses. I would prefer to re-pin, but this is a triage job. A very elderly client, probably on a fixed income, who uses the piano infrequently. I'm going to give the alcohol/water a try. If the results aren't good enough, I'll go to plan B.<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>David<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Dale Erwin<br><b>Sent:</b> Saturday, March 10, 2012 4:36 PM<br><b>To:</b> pianotech@ptg.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [pianotech] shrinking with H20 & alcohol-revisited<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:navy'> David<br> Don is giving excellent advice.<br> I will add one caveat. Though the bushings have been treated with protek I'd still try alcohol and water first. Yes its counter to the advice given, but I have been in your shoes and done just what I am suggesting and it solved most of the problems. Find the tightest sample and try a solution with an educated guess method. Apply and wait to see what happens,... if nothing then proceed with Dons good advice. That said usually there will be some still too tight or loose and repinning is the correct remedy.<br> And ...one strength solution doesn't fit all. Another words 50/50 mix may be ok for the tightest ones but not the lesser tight ones.<br> As always the strength of the remedy is result driven.<o:p></o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:mediumblue'>Dale Erwin RPT-</span></b><b><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:black'><br></span></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'>Mason & Hamlin/Steinway/U.S pianos<br></span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:mediumblue'>Pre-hung Ronsen hammer sets/Abel parts</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'><br></span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:darkgreen'>Sitka Soundboards & Supplies<br></span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:black'><a href="http://WWW.Erwinspiano.com">WWW.Erwinspiano.com</a></span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:darkgreen'><br></span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:crimson'>209-577-8397</span></i></b><b><i><span style='font-size:7.5pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:darkgreen'><br></span></i></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:darkgreen'><br><tt> </tt></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Courier New";color:navy'><br><tt> </tt></span><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:navy'><o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Comic Sans MS";color:navy'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>-----Original Message-----<br>From: Don Mannino <<a href="mailto:donmannino@ca.rr.com">donmannino@ca.rr.com</a>><br>To: pianotech <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>><br>Sent: Sat, Mar 10, 2012 11:20 am<br>Subject: Re: [pianotech] shrinking with H20 & alcohol-revisited<o:p></o:p></span></p><div id="AOLMsgPart_1_85cf3b7e-d7df-44ad-ab9b-2bf32b3fdf1f"><div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>David,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>After being lubricated over time, it is not likely that Alcohol and Water will do much. The tightness could be caused by things other than simply tight bushing cloth (burrs on pins, distorted old hammer flanges, etc.), plus the lubricants tend to reduce the ability of the water to do anything – the cloth doesn’t swell then shrink like it should.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It’s best to apply it with a dropper to the individual bushings. Rubbing alcohol is a good mix, and if you watch closely with good lighting you will see if the water is penetrating the bushings – it should wick right into the cloth. If not, then it’s not likely to do any good.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>If you might have to take the flanges off the rail, why, then you are already done with ½ of the repinning job. Just ream and repin and be done with it.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Do watch for flanges that squeeze and distort when tightening the screws. This is pretty common with old wood flanges. If the fit is tight when it is in on the rail, but becomes free when you unscrew it, that is very likely the source of the problem. So new flanges would be the answer, and this would also eliminate the oily bushings from the piano while you are at it.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Don Mannino<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>-----Original Message-----<br>From: David Weiss <<a href="mailto:davidweiss@embarqmail.com"><span style='color:windowtext'>davidweiss@embarqmail.com</span></a>><br>To: pianotech <<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org"><span style='color:windowtext'>pianotech@ptg.org</span></a>><br>Sent: Sat, Mar 10, 2012 1:17 am<br>Subject: [pianotech] shrinking with H20 & alcohol-revisited<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><div id="AOLMsgPart_1_9aa01727-b977-4483-818b-6c9cca436b5f"><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I have an old upright with perennial tight action centers. Protek provides only temporary relief so I want to try using H2O with alcohol. <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Can I apply the alcohol to the hammer flanges without removing them from the rail? My concern is that the water/alcohol mixture will run over into onto the hammer butt or spring punching and loosen the glue.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>David Weiss<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org">pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a> [<a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org?">mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Tom Driscoll<br><b>Sent:</b> Friday, November 25, 2011 10:13 AM<br><b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a><br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [pianotech] piano behavior - shrinking with H20 & alcohol<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Rick,<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> I use denatured alc mixed 50 -50 with water.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> Tom D.<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid black 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-right:0in;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Subject:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> Re: [pianotech] piano behavior - shrinking with H20 & alcohol<o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>What is the ratio of water to alcohol ?<br><br>Rick Ucci <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><a href="http://uccipiano.com/" target="_blank">Uccipiano.com</a><o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div><div><div><div style='margin-left:.5in'><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><br> <o:p></o:p></span></p></div></div></div></blockquote></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></body></html>