<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns:m="http://schemas.microsoft.com/office/2004/12/omml" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"><head><meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"><meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 12 (filtered medium)"><style></style></head><body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=purple><div class=WordSection1><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Yes, quite far off the mark.  Let’s not let the facts get in the way of our beliefs.  Joe lives just outside of Portland, not exactly poor man’s territory.  And “Richperson’s Retirementland” ???  Terry can address his own demographics and will, I’m sure, but most retirees that I know, well off or not, are not spending their money on piano rebuilding.  They’re giving the old piano to the grandkids and letting them have at it if they so choose.   <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>This conversation has taken on a real Twilight Zone tone.  <o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>An ordinary piano, or is it….<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>David Love<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>www.davidlovepianos.com<o:p></o:p></span></p><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'> pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Euphonious Thumpe<br><b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, July 31, 2012 2:06 PM<br><b>To:</b> pianotech@ptg.org<br><b>Subject:</b> Re: [pianotech] NY Times article on pianos<o:p></o:p></span></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Yes, I believed so. It seemed to me that you were criticizing Joe for taking on work for what he could get for it in HIS market, rather than holding out for what YOU can get for it down there in "Richperson's Retirementland". <br>I really would prefer to get along with everyone on this list, when at all possible, and sincerely respect all consummate perfectionists ( such as I believe you are ) so please correct me if I am wrong. (And I invite all others who consider that last post of mine to be "off the mark" -or not- to similarly "chime in".)<br><br>Regards,<br>Thumpe<o:p></o:p></p></div></td></tr></table><div id="_origMsg_"><div><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><hr size=1 width="100%" align=center></span></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Terry Farrell <<a href="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</a>>; <br><b>To: </b><<a href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">pianotech@ptg.org</a>>; <br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [pianotech] NY Times article on pianos <br><b>Sent: </b>Tue, Jul 31, 2012 8:37:55 PM </span><o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal>And does your post have anything to do with what I posted?<o:p></o:p></p><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal>Terry Farrell<o:p></o:p></p></div><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div><p class=MsoNormal>On Jul 31, 2012, at 10:19 AM, Euphonious Thumpe wrote:<o:p></o:p></p></div><p class=MsoNormal><br><br><o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><div><p class=MsoNormal>I believe we should all be tolerant and respectful regarding the exceedingly different socioeconomic climates in different parts of this nation. In some, money is often "no object", in others, people spend nothing on pianos, <br>or as little as possible. Here, for example, several decent-condition Steinway uprights recently sold at a school system auction for $200 each. A buyer asked what I'd charge to tune one, and even $75 was too much for him. <br>(Including helping him move it, if I remember correctly.) And in some areas, the "wealthy"people are no more inclined to spend money on their pianos than the poor. Expenses also vary greatly among us: some own houses and shops, others have mortgages or rent. And some techs ARE willing to work for free, or close to it. So it's really whatever that works between a tech and a customer that is "fair". What is NOT fair, in my opinion, is govermnent policies that allow predatory marketing by overseas suppliers to put our factories and workers out of business!<br><br>Thumpe<br><br>P.S. If our government did not subsidize "Big Oil", and instead forced it to pay for the environmental damage it causes, the cost of shipping things from overseas (in ships that burn nasty "bunker oil", especially ) would greatly rise, making domestic production far more competitive!<o:p></o:p></p></div></td></tr></table><div id="_origMsg_"><div><p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p><div><div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'><hr size=1 width="100%" align=center></span></div><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From: </span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>Terry Farrell <<a href="javascript:return" target="_blank">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</a>>; <br><b>To: </b><<a href="javascript:return" target="_blank">pianotech@ptg.org</a>>; <br><b>Subject: </b>Re: [pianotech] NY Times article on pianos <br><b>Sent: </b>Tue, Jul 31, 2012 9:34:15 AM </span><o:p></o:p></p><table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0><tr><td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'><p class=MsoNormal style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'>Boy oh boy Joe. I at least hope your foot was clean before you went and stuck it in your mouth!  ;-)<br><br>You talk of "REAL rebuilding" and say that the piano you post about "got it all". Okay, great! So it got refinished, keys & keybed rebuilt, all new action, new redesigned belly, etc., etc. Wow, that's great & nifty!!! And let's see, that would easily add up to.... oh, let's even be very conservative - maybe $20K to $25K - unless of course one is running a piano non-profit missionary. Okay, so far, so good! <br><br>Now, I'm not really so up on the cost of new upright Pleyel's. Am I safe to think that they might be somewhere in the range of a new high-end Yamaha or Steinway? So maybe $15K to $20K? X3 would be $45K to $60K - but you only charged $20K to $25. If you had done it for 1/3 the cost of a new Pleyel, you would have had to have only charged maybe $7K or so.<br><br>That's goofy man. I'd get that for the action & keys alone. So like you do belly work for free? This really does not add up at all Joe. Please explain. Or was this only written for our entertainment?<br><br>I think I gotcha here fella!!!!!<br><br>Terry Farrell<br><br><br>On Jul 31, 2012, at 12:01 AM, Joseph Garrett wrote:<br><br>> Wim,<br>> That is YOUR opinion not MINE!<br>> I've just completed an 1860 ish German Upright. Straight Strung. It is<br>> Circasian Walnut, with beautiful carvings and candleabras. It got it all,<br>> EXCEPT to be refinished.  (The customer likes it with all it's "character<br>> marks".<G>) The cost? I won't say.. However, that little cottage piano is<br>> absolutely GEORGOUS! Tonally, Aesthetically and with a nice light touch,<br>> (typical of those of that period). I'd put it up against anything out there<br>> of comparable size and of twice what I did the total rebuild for. This<br>> little piano would knock the doors off of the BEST Pleyel! AND, at about<br>> 1/3 the cost of that Pleyel! That is the only piano that would come close<br>> to how this piano is. You tell me that "..in the "grand old day"...blah de<br>> blah crap! This IS the grand olde days.. You live in a totally weird place<br>> that is not suitable for any decent piano to reside and complain about the<br>> crap you have to work on??? You don't have a clue about REAL rebuilding and<br>> care and love that goes into it. All you care about is the BOTTOM LINE.<br>> Horse pucky!<br>> Joe<o:p></o:p></p></td></tr></table></div></div></div></div></div></td></tr></table><p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif"'><o:p> </o:p></span></p></div></div></div></div></body></html>