<html xmlns:v="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:vml" xmlns:o="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:office" xmlns:w="urn:schemas-microsoft-com:office:word" xmlns="http://www.w3.org/TR/REC-html40"> <head> <meta http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=us-ascii"> <meta name=Generator content="Microsoft Word 11 (filtered medium)">  <style>  </style> </head> <body lang=EN-US link=blue vlink=blue> <div class=Section1> One consideration is to use back-rail action cloth. One roll makes two strips, is stronger, frays a little but doesn’t get yukky as I find muting strips do….<o:p></o:p> Les bartlett<o:p></o:p> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <div class=MsoNormal align=center style='text-align:center'> <hr size=2 width="100%" align=center tabindex=-1> </div> From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org] On Behalf Of tnrwim@aol.com Sent: Friday, January 11, 2013 10:44 PM To: pianotech@ptg.org Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reducing tuning time (was Re: frustrated)<o:p></o:p> </div> <o:p> </o:p> <div> <blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid blue 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 2.0pt; margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'><pre><tt>Would thick key bushing cloth work ? (I have a whole roll of that - used in <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre><tt>various places for player work)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre><tt>Duaine</tt><o:p></o:p></pre></blockquote> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Duaine<o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> If you're going to use a strip mute, Schaff actually sells that. (page 36), in .165", .135" and .115" thickness, 50" long, and tapering from 3/4" to 1/2" wide. Measure your keybusing cloth and see how close that is. Or, look at some of the other felts you've got, and see which works best for you. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> For the midsection, you need to push the strip between the strings and give it enough of a loop to allow the middle string to vibrate. For the upper section, put the temperament strip on top of the dampers, and when you've got them all done, pull the dampers away with your fingers, and push the strip between the strings and the damper felts. Be careful that you don't damage the damper felts. On some pianos, the dampers don't want to come away from the string very much, so put your business card between the string and the damper, and the temperament strips will go down very easy. When you tune this section, the strings will vibrate a little, as if you've got the damper pedal on, but not enough to where it interferes with the tuning. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> But I stopped using a temperament strip about 10 years ago. I found using rubber mutes, even for a pitch raise, is much faster and easier. Since you're already doing that, don't change your method.  For the upper treble, I use a split mute, part 204 on page 36. <o:p></o:p> </div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> <div> Wim<o:p></o:p> </div> <div> <div>  <o:p></o:p> </div> </div> <div> -----Original Message----- From: Duaine Hechler <dahechler@att.net> To: pianotech <pianotech@ptg.org> Sent: Fri, Jan 11, 2013 4:58 pm Subject: Re: [pianotech] Reducing tuning time (was Re: frustrated)<o:p></o:p> <div id="AOLMsgPart_0_ec6584e3-e764-4e36-90c0-3fe32ee1451d"><pre style='background:white'><tt>Thanks, this is all great advice.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Now - what are the tricks to strip mute ?<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>When I first started, I tried to strip mute and could never get enough space in <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>the loops and the felt seemed too thick.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Also, since most of mine are uprights, it seems the traditional strip mute is <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>too wide for the upper notes (either the <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>dampers are in the way or the hammers are blocks)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>There must be a special technique for getting the right size loop - and - <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>getting the right size mute felt so the above <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>does not happen.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Would thick key bushing cloth work ? (I have a whole roll of that - used in <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>various places for player work)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Duaine<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>On 01/11/2013 04:04 PM, Duaine Hechler wrote:<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> I've been tuning, with an ETD, now for about 13 years and I can't seem to get <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>much faster than about 2 hrs.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> First, 99% of my tunings are pitch raises - one pass - with a very wide range <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>of cents - usually way flat.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> Hear is the basics I do.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> - Start from A0 and go up.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> - Leap frog mutes - (M=mute, TM = tune middle, TL = tune left, TR = tune <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>right, S = String group)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>   (I think this is accurate ? - I had to draw the strings and place and move <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>mutes on paper)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>   M1 - TM1 - M2 | M2 - S2 - M1 | TL1 | TM2 | M1 - S3 - M2 | TR1 | TL2 | TM3 | <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>M2 - S4 - M1 | TR2 | TL3 | TM4 <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> ..............<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>   So I think I'm already moving mutes as little as possible.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> - Pull strings slightly sharp of pitch then back down to pitch (seems better <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>for stability)<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> - Check for stability<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> I know that going sharp and coming back down -  takes time.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> Any pointers to get faster ? On the upper treble, is it better (hearing wise) <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>to pull up to pitch or go down to pitch ?<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>> On 01/11/2013 12:22 PM, <a href="mailto:tunerboy3@comcast.net">tunerboy3@comcast.net</a> wrote:<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>> I wouldn't waste that much time on any piano. 4 or 5 hours on just the <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>tuning? No way.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>> I will normally spend about one hour to tune a piano. 2 hours if it's a <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>concert tuning.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>> I would try to figure out what the problem is.<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>> Jerry Groot RPT<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>>> <a href="http://www.grootpiano.com" target="_blank">www.grootpiano.com</a><o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>-- <o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Duaine Hechler<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Piano, Player Piano, Pump Organ - Tuning, Servicing & Rebuilding<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>(314) 838-5587 / <a href="mailto:dahechler@att.net">dahechler@att.net</a> / <a href="http://www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com" target="_blank">www.hechlerpianoandorgan.com</a><o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt>Home & Business user of Linux - 12 years<o:p></o:p></tt></pre><pre style='background:white'><tt><o:p> </o:p></tt></pre></div> </div> </div> </body> </html>