<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META content="text/html; charset=windows-1252" = http-equiv=Content-Type> <META content="MSHTML 5.00.2919.6307" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV>Grin... sorry... of course I meant re-seating the strings on the = bridge... this also is the case if you tap the pins themselves a bit deeper into = the holes.  Rons comments pertaining to the so called "bottoming out = theory" and to this string seating buisness jive well with my own = experience. </DIV> <DIV>Hi Richard. I don't mean to burst your bubble. You have good = suggestions. But this is a four-year-old Steinway, and the customer is not aware that = her piano is imperfect. Depending on what is ultimately the cause of the = falseness, the potential for a warranty claim is always a possibility. So, being = that the customer is not looking for a solution at this time, and I am not = looking for a mistake to make, I wish to simply understand as much as possible, and = not tap at this point.  :-) </DIV> <DIV>Terry Farrell Piano Tuning & Service Tampa, Florida <A = href="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</A></DI= V> <BLOCKQUOTE style="BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: = 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black">From: <A href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no" title=Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no>Richard Brekne</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">To: <A = href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org" title=pianotech@ptg.org>pianotech@ptg.org</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">Sent: Thursday, January 25, = 2001 2:57 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">Subject: Re: More False Beats S&S</DIV> <DIV> </DIV> Farrell wrote: <BLOCKQUOTE = cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com" type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Thanks for the thoughts = Richard.</PRE><PRE wrap=""> In this case, I am not entirely = convinced at this point that I am looking at a case of loose bridge = pins. <</PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">As far as lessening of the = falseness, you probably achieved a very temporary solution by = re-seating the pins. </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> Grin... sorry... of course I meant re-seating the strings on the bridge... = this also is the case if you tap the pins themselves a bit deeper into the = holes.  Rons comments pertaining to the so called "bottoming out theory" and = to this string seating buisness jive well with my own experience. <BLOCKQUOTE = cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com" type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> Reseating the pins? I did not = push/tap the pins. I did however seat the strings in every gently way = I could think of. </PRE><PRE wrap=""> Have you noticed that = Ron has not provided input on my recent post regarding how many hours = one would charge a client to recap a bass bridge (I did request that = no bionic bridge dudes need reply!)? = ;-) </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE> Perhaps he was in for a bionic check up .... or too busy with those two = preverted posts... you know the ones... "zipping up the fly in public" and " sun = bleached tail". grin.... <BLOCKQUOTE = cite="mid:007f01c08666$961ddea0$bb492041@tampabay.rr.com" type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> Terry Farrell Piano Tuning & = Service Tampa, Florida <A class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated = href="mailto:mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</A> = ----- Original Message ----- From: "Richard Brekne" <A = class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E = href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib..no"><Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib= .no></A> To: <A class=moz-txt-link-rfc2396E = href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org"><pianotech@ptg.org></A> Sent: = Wednesday, January 24, 2001 5:21 PM Subject: Re: More False Beats = S&S </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> Farrell = wrote: </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">Tuning a 1996 S&S M = today I noticed many prominent false beats in the hi-treble = section.....cymbal-tone syndrome.... Gently place rod on = top </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">of bridge = pin... False beat does not go away, but.tone dies out real fast, like = the string was poorly muted. </PRE>> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> Terry I have noticed = the same thing on the Steinway grands, and have yet to encounter that = same muting of the sound on other pianos... I really don't know why = this is the case... I do know that if you find you can get rid of = some of the falseness this way, then CA or epoxy in the Bridge pin = holes will help. As far as the cymbal syndrome is concerned... = you are not the first person to mention this in relation to Steinways = (or other grands with highly active front duplexes) Solution is to = redress the capo bar and voice the hammers. You can also get into = retuning the duplex... read Ed McMorrows book for some interesting = thoughts on this point. He refers to this "cymbal syndrome" of yours = to a kind of whistling noise. At least I think you are talking about = the same thing... :) </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> So what happened in = the lower half of this section? Why did jus! t </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">touching </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">(super-duper lightly = only) the forward bridge pins cause the strings = to </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">mute </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">out? On the Boston that I = posted on recently, as well as many = other </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">pianos, </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">you hear a false beat and = when you press gently on loose bridge = pin, </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">false </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">beat is eliminated AND = tone remains clear </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">Don't worry = about the muting effect... it wont happen when you CA or Epoxy the = Bridge pins. As far as lessening of the falseness, you probably = achieved a very temporary solution by re-seating the pins. I like Ron = N's position on this seating business... makes a lot of = sense. </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">I'm really trying to = understand the causes of so much garbage = sounds </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">that </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">emanate from the high = treble of pianos (er, a, well thinking of = some </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE = wrap="">other </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap="">pianos, I guess anywhere = on the scale!). Any thoughts on this = situation? </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap=""> You and just about = everyone else. Its fascinating for sure. Lots of sources of diverse = types of noise and falseness. As far as the muting effect you = observed... I think .... and only think... (as I am but an egg in = these matters) that the Steinway bridge and bridge pin configuration = is like highly sensitive to changes in mass. Clamp a small vise grips = onto a bridge pin on a Steinway and the string goes dead sounding... = but on many other pianos there is only a small difference in sound = quality. Why this is the case...beats me but I bet the answer is an = interesting one. </PRE> <BLOCKQUOTE type="cite"><PRE wrap=""> Terry = Farrell Piano Tuning & Service Tampa, Florida <A = class=moz-txt-link-abbreviated = href="mailto:mfarrel2@tamp!abay.rr.com">mfarrel2@tampabay.rr.com</A><BR= > </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE><PRE wrap="">-- Richard Brekne RPT, = N.P.T.F. Bergen, Norway <A class=moz-txt-link-freetext = href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg..uib.no">mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.= uib.no</A> </PRE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE> <PRE = class=moz-signature>-- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. Bergen, Norway <A class=moz-txt-link-freetext = href="mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.uib.no">mailto:Richard.Brekne@grieg.u= ib.no</A></PRE> </BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>