<html> <body> Doug, Maybe I've missed a post but I haven't seen anyone say this. (Flame suit at the ready!) :-) IMO, if a piano is more than 10 cents or so flat (or sharp, for that matter), you need to do a "pitch adjustment". That's going to involve more than just tuning it one time! That's the crucial thing. You need to explain to the customer that it needs TWO tunings at one sitting. The first one of course, isn't really a tuning. It's just to get it up to pitch (a little over if everything looks OK.). I use an SAT III so I use the pitch raise function. Then you have to go back over it and give it a "fine" tuning. Of course, if you're doing a pitch raise of 50+cents, it's not going to be possible to "fine" tune it with only two tunings. Do it 2-3 times and tell them that it should be tuned again in 2-3 months if they want it reasonably stabilized. Of course, this should have been explained before you even started. If they don't/won't agree to the extra cost, just offer to give them a referral and walk away. Otherwise, you definitely have your reputation on the line! JMHO! Avery P.S. For a "normal" pitch raise + a tuning, I charge half my tuning fee extra. No exceptions! At 07:51 PM 12/13/04, you wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">As a new piano tuner, I am learning a lot as I go and tune different piano’s and typically I am tuning the older piano’s and some new/better ones.  This past Sat. I tuned a piano for a home that had a console that had never been tuned ‘in a long time’. I warned them that I might break strings and that it will go out of tune quickly because of the condition of the strings and the piano itself. Well I was called back by the customer saying ‘the piano is still out of tune and you must not have checked it before you left’.  Before I left I told him, ‘your piano is most likely going to go flat somewhat because it has not been tuned at all in such a long time (20+ yrs) and that it should tuned every 6 months. The piano was old and recently had some action work, but the strings looked old and dirty.  I was careful not to break any strings and when I left it sounded good and the funny thing was the customer said it sounded good after I finished. It was not that out of tune, A440 sounded like it was between g-sharp and a, but not an entire half/step off.   So, what do I do now? Has anyone been in my shoes before? Go back and do a ‘free’ fix it up tuning, or tell him, he has to pay for a 2nd tuning. Is this going to risk my reputation? He had the action done by another local PTG member and I am afraid that if I don’t go back and ‘fix’ this, I am going to get that reputation and the other PTG member might tell others about the ‘part time’ tooner, which I do not want to be and this is why I joined the PTG, to get better. Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated.   I thought the tuning was good, inspite of the condition of the piano and the strings. It sounded alot better, but I knew it was going to need another tuning soon.   Any advice, thoughts?   Thanks. Doug Renz Associate PTG member, Rochester, NY</blockquote></body> </html>