<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN"> <HTML><HEAD> <META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; = charset=iso-8859-1"> <META content="MSHTML 6.00.2800.1458" name=GENERATOR> <STYLE></STYLE> </HEAD> <BODY bgColor=#ffffff> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT = face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> = pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>daniel sicardi<BR><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, September 11, 2004 6:27 = PM<BR><B>To:</B> Pianotech<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: Water stain<BR><BR></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>Thanks a lot Paul. = Are you sure that the top of this piano is made out of veneer and particle board. = The reason that I am asking is because the piece is pretty heavy. I have a = lot of experience dealing with particle board. Usually I just throw it away = and get a piece of lumber. That would mean that the top of the console was = a sandwich with veneer on both sides. That seems to be pretty expensive! = I guess solid Walnut was expensive in 1976 too!The Bottom side has those = Chicago World's Fair Decals that Kimball had used for so long. I thought that = heat (like from a heat gun or even an iron would cause the area to = contract. (Of course you have to be real careful not to scorch the work = area)</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>I will = check out Rockwell...... Thank You<BR><SPAN class=173013702-12092004><FONT color=#0000ff>[Paul Chick (Earthlink)] </FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004><FONT color=#0000ff>Daniel</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004><FONT color=#0000ff>My mistake---it's = Rockler, not Rockwell.  Sorry!</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004><FONT color=#0000ff>I prepped hundreds of Kimballs for a major dealer in the Midwest during the = seventies...can you imagine a semi truck loaded with two levels of Kimball consoles, = all the same model and finish?  Yes, the lid is heavy, probably heavier = than solid walnut.  Particle board back then was used because it was surprisingly stable, could be worked with woodworking machines, = etc.  It is/was not the MDF we see today making the lids heavy.  We saw a = number of lids swell when a plant was over watered and un-noticed until it = was too late.  No repair possible-order a new lid.  The damaged lids = gave us a chance to see whats under the veneer...they were sanded smooth then = veneered with the desired species--no cross banding, it wasn't needed. The = core stock was a chipboard type of sheet stock. Both sides were = veneered to keep moisture absorption relatively equal, BTW, both sides also have = the same amount of finish.</FONT> <FONT color=#0000ff>  This = helped keep the lids flat without using wide, stiff lid moldings.  Solid = stock is too expensive and too unstable, so most panels in pianos are/were "built = up" to control warping, manufacturing rejects/defects and keep costs = down....more information than you ever needed to know.  Avoid using solid = stock for a replacement lid, unless you are skilled in designing and fabricating = such a panel.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff = size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff = size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004>Good = luck.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff = size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff = size=2><SPAN class=173013702-12092004>Paul C</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; = BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV> <DIV style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: = black"><B>From:</B> <A title=tune4@earthlink.net = href="mailto:tune4@earthlink.net">Paul Chick (Earthlink)</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A = title=pianotech@ptg.org href="mailto:pianotech@ptg.org">Pianotech</A> </DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, September 11, = 2004 10:06 AM</DIV> <DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: Water = stain</DIV> <DIV><BR></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT> </DIV> <BLOCKQUOTE dir=ltr style="MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px"> <DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader dir=ltr align=left><FONT = face=Tahoma size=2>-----Original Message-----<BR><B>From:</B> <A = href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org">pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</A> [mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org]<B>On Behalf Of </B>daniel sicardi<BR><B>Sent:</B> Friday, September 10, 2004 10:39 = AM<BR><B>To:</B> Pianotech<BR><B>Subject:</B> Water stain<BR><BR></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>There has got to = be lots of people out there with more experience in dealing with this = "common" issue than I have.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>I have a Walnut = Console piano.  The piano is a Kimball. It is about 30 years old and = in perfect perfect perfect mechanical condition. It sounds great with = very little wear. It has a water stain that went completely through the = protective polyvarithaine or whatever was used to protect the piano.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>There was so = little left of the protective coat, that it only took a few minutes to remove it = completely from the top of the instrument.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>I used various = gauges of sandpaper and removed the water stain from the left side of the = instrument almost completely. I have not been so lucky with the right side. I = have even used a belt sander which has reduced the water stain a bit = but not completely. I applied good furniture polish to the entire piano. = It sparkles.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>I still have a = bump (not a depression) where the original owner's ficus once stood. = </FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>I was wondering = if anyone had any suggestions as to how to deal with this minor = annoyance.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#000000 size=2>I figured you = pros might have had experience with heat guns or something of a different nature = to deal with this issue.</FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2>Danny<BR></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><SPAN = class=462010014-11092004><FONT color=#0000ff>Daniel</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT color=#000000><FONT face=Arial><FONT size=2><SPAN = class=462010014-11092004><FONT color=#0000ff>The raised area = indicates the core has absorbed moisture and swelled, never to shrink again = because it is made out of particle board.  The stains sound = like mineral stains-very difficult to remove.  As a rule, we simply strip = and level the panel, then re-veneer it and stain and color = to match.  Veneer is available with a pressure sensitive = adhesive ( PSA ) on it.  All you need to do is peel off the backing and = stick it down, it will NOT come = off.</FONT></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN class=462010014-11092004> </SPAN><SPAN class=462010014-11092004> Rockwell is one company that = comes to mind.  They have a website.</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN = = class=462010014-11092004></SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT> </DIV> <DIV><FONT face=Arial><FONT color=#0000ff><FONT size=2><SPAN = class=462010014-11092004>Paul = C</SPAN></FONT></FONT></FONT></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE></BLOCKQUOTE= ></BODY></HTML>