<!doctype html public "-//w3c//dtd html 4.0 transitional//en"> <html>   Christopher Witmer wrote: <blockquote TYPE=CITE>  > Sheeshh guy... its one of the basic assumptions of the faith.. having grown up in a > preachers family, having a brother for a preacher and in general inumerouse > relatives involved in the faith, having studied a bit of religion in early collage > days, etc etc ad absurdum... I have a degree of basic exposure to christian > theology. What on earth do you think we are supposed to need Christ for ??? Your > three catagories dont really address this issue anyways. Sorry, I misunderstood what you meant. If you're talking about human kind's original fall into sin through the covenantal representation of Adam, your use of the expression "in the end" confused me. But even then, you are still wrong. The particularly Christian view is precisely the opposite of what you assert! Viz, perhaps the most famous words in the Bible: "For God so loved the world that He gave His only begotten Son, that whoever believes in Him should not perish but have everlasting life. For God did not send His Son into the world to condemn the world, but that the world through Him might be saved." -- John 3:16-17 That's not describing the ultimate doom of human kind, but rather its salvation. As great as human kind's sin is, God's love is greater.</blockquote> It describes exactly the doom of humankind. Jimminees Christmas.,... its right in front of your nose and you dont see it. What the frog is the point of God sending his son to into the world in order to save them unless they need saving in the first place eh ????? Human kind, left to themselves are doomed to fail. Sheeshhh.. otherwise what on earth or heaven do we have any use for God for anyways ??  Perhaps you misunderstand the word doom ??? <blockquote TYPE=CITE>  Wishing all a truly joyous Christmas season.</blockquote> Yes... I can aggree with that.. :) <blockquote TYPE=CITE>  -- Chris Witmer</blockquote> -- Richard Brekne RPT, N.P.T.F. Bergen, Norway  </html>