<html> <body> David, At 09:02 PM 3/24/2005, you wrote: <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite=""> Actually, I’m talking about a new Renner underlever system.  The gram levels start out around 25 grams at note 1 and graduate downward.  I take these measurements with a gram gauge with the back action on the bench so that I can adjust the spring tension.  The question remains, at what point in the travel is the best place to take the reading.</blockquote> Since the spring rate will change through travel from rest through stopping (either with the upstop rail or the end of the key movement), perhaps taking readings at several points through the travel of the underlever and then using an average would accomplish what you seem to be seeking. <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">   Ideally, I want only enough tension to get decent shut off but not so much that there is a noticeable difference between playing the piano with the damper pedal engaged versus not engaged.  I don’t like to notice that I am lifting the damper with my finger too much. </blockquote> Correct. <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">  The next question is what is the minimum resistance that will still produce decent shut off. I suppose it depends on the size of the piano and the string mass, so for arguments sake let’s say your normal 6 foot Steinway.  </blockquote> There are at least a couple of other factors at work here.  The two that first come to mind is the length and spacing of the damper felt, which is often (especially since the mid-60's) poorly done in production and often simply copied later.  Wally used to teach a class in which this was discussed in detail.  I am presently out of town, and do not have access to those notes.  Perhaps someone else does. Best. Horace <blockquote type=cite class=cite cite="">   David Love davidlovepianos@comcast.net -----Original Message----- From: pianotech-bounces@ptg.org [<a href="mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org" eudora="autourl"> mailto:pianotech-bounces@ptg.org</a>] On Behalf Of Joe Garrett Sent: Thursday, March 24, 2005 8:56 PM To: pianotech Subject: Under lever gram resistance     <pre>When setting the gram resistance of on underlevers, what is the best</pre> <pre>point at which to take the measurement.  The higher you lift the lever,</pre> <pre>of course, the greater the resistance, so where in the travel should the</pre> <pre>reading be taken?</pre> <pre> </pre> <pre>David,</pre> <pre> If you are trying to "gauge" the underlever when it is in the piano.....NOT! Gram resistance should be taken on the flange, as with the underlever out of the piano!</pre> <pre>The listed, (Steinway), resistances are: Lever Flange: 3-6, (I prefer 3-5); Top Flange: 1-3</pre> <pre>These numbers are from the OLDE Steinway Service Manual, so they pertain to older Steinways. If the flanges you are checking are Teflon or Graphite impregnated, then all bets are off.<G></pre> <pre>Best Regards</pre> Joe Garrett, R.P.T. Captain, Tool Police Squares R I</blockquote></body> </html>